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11-22-2016, 03:52 PM
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UConn thread....
Getting close...a few hours.
The local papers are describing the Dayton game as the "first of three" between the schools, with the next two in 2019/2020 and 2020/2021. Earlier I expressed the opinion that with JJ gone the next two may not be played.
This series is very unusual for UConn. UConn plays very few non-con away games...very few. The non-con away games are almost always part of a home-and-home with a power opponent or a so-called "home coming" game in or very near the home town of a graduating senior star. The Dayton series is an exception. Good for us.
Re tonight's game: Will the Flyers be intimidated by a crowd of ~ 8500? I think I read that attendance was only a few hundred at Princeton. UConn's Samuelson shoots threes as if they were foul shots....have got to get after her!
We need to make shots, especially open shots of which there will be few. We need to handle a pressure defense. And, we've got to keep the TOs under 100.
I'm hoping, praying, for a respectable showing.
Go Flyers!
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11-22-2016, 04:47 PM
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UConn would probably turn a bunch of turnovers into a bunch of easy points. But, I think UD has to play at a fast pace and hit some transitition jumpers to keep it respectable. If they are forced to play in the half court against UConn's defense it will be a long night.
But, regardless of the outcome UConn plays with great concentration on every posession which will be good for the UD players to see and learn from.
Jenna and Kelley will not be intimidated, not sure about anyone else.
I would love to see you on sports center in the morning celebrating a UD win in the UConn crowd.
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11-22-2016, 05:23 PM
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No TV for me...
Originally Posted by UDBrian
UConn would probably turn a bunch of turnovers into a bunch of easy points. But, I think UD has to play at a fast pace and hit some transitition jumpers to keep it respectable. If they are forced to play in the half court against UConn's defense it will be a long night.
But, regardless of the outcome UConn plays with great concentration on every posession which will be good for the UD players to see and learn from.
Jenna and Kelley will not be intimidated, not sure about anyone else.
I would love to see you on sports center in the morning celebrating a UD win in the UConn crowd.
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I would love that too....I'll settle for a respectable showing. The last time I saw UD at Storrs Hoover/Mallott were freshmen. It wasn't pretty. A few years later that pair and teammates gave UConn a great game in the NCAAs, earning the series that begins tonight.
The few Dayton fans that travel with the team will be cross-court from me near the UD bench. My Dayton sweatshirt will be the only one in my section. But, the cameras look over my shoulder....so, no Sports Center.
Go Flyers!
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11-22-2016, 05:37 PM
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Looking forward to seeing our team play one of the best sports programs ever created. Hats off to UConn women, they win and do it the right way.
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11-22-2016, 06:10 PM
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Few predictions: two turnovers in the first 90 seconds. close to 30 turnovers. Probably a final score of 89-47. Shoot around 29% from the floor. Commit lots of fouls. Killed on the boards. Probably a ton of UConn second chance points. It is what it is. There are no Malotts and Hoovers out there now.
UConn plays harder than any other team. They get the best players, but Geno gets them to play hard every play. Nobody else does that. Thats where they kill you. They expend more energy in the first 8 minutes than most teams will do in 40.
Whatever happens, it will be a net positive. The expectation starts at 0. If you do anything remotely solid, you walk away feeling really good.
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11-22-2016, 06:50 PM
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11-22-2016, 07:29 PM
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UConn up 22-13 at end of first even though Flyers playing fairly well.
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11-22-2016, 07:40 PM
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Scaife looking like a Freshman today so far.
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11-22-2016, 07:48 PM
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Originally Posted by jaburr91
Scaife looking like a Freshman today so far.
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Scaife has been the last person down the court on several possessions. Needs to sit the pine if she is not going to bring the energy
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11-22-2016, 07:52 PM
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About the only good thing about the second quarter is getting two fouls on Samuelson...UConn leads 51-31 at half.
That said, I still think Flyers are playing fairly well. UConn is just smooooooth.
Last edited by jaburr91; 11-22-2016 at 07:54 PM..
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11-22-2016, 07:56 PM
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General of the Air Force
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Dayton playing a step slow on defense, and can't hang out at the parimeter all night long. Need someone in the post to deliver.
Giving up too many second chance points.
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11-22-2016, 08:11 PM
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Poor defense and poor shot selection are killing us. Austria is not the player she was.
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11-22-2016, 08:15 PM
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Our defense is a joke. Layups and open threes.
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11-22-2016, 08:27 PM
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Post players are being undressed. And much of it is from an inexcusable lack of work rate. Time and again getting beat for back doors, defensive rebounds, and being left in a vapor trail in transition defense.
Our bigs take every other play off. UConn's dont. The end.
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11-22-2016, 08:27 PM
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We have added a new dimension in our defense.....the sieve.
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11-22-2016, 08:31 PM
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We'd be in this game if we played defense in the post.....way too many easy layups.
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11-22-2016, 08:32 PM
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Played them even in the third. Wish we had inside defense.
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11-22-2016, 08:34 PM
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We are letting them shoot 49%. This is not your mother's UConn team. Thank goodness because this is not your mother's Dayton team.
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11-22-2016, 08:37 PM
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Fouls and walks by uconn not called, but they can shoot.
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11-22-2016, 08:46 PM
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Our defense - such as it is - is one hot mess.
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11-22-2016, 08:47 PM
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Can't hang onto a rebound for the life of them. I N E P T. They are not going to like looking at the film of this one.
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11-22-2016, 08:51 PM
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Glad to see Shauna playing all the players, it should pay dividends down the road. Good experience for the freshmen and non starters.
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11-22-2016, 08:51 PM
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Originally Posted by NovaFlyer
Fouls and walks by uconn not called, but they can shoot.
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Amen. They bump the dribbler every time down the floor, and has not been called once.
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11-22-2016, 08:59 PM
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Don't like Scaife game tonight, every time she got the ball she was determined to shoot, open or not. Would not pass to the open player.
Not sure what it will take to get Maddy going she can't hit a trey to save her soul.
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11-22-2016, 09:04 PM
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Burdette and Canatelli both with 15, other than that no one else could put it in the net.
Good news is we won't play anyone the rest of the of season their caliber, good experience for everyone even if their was a great deal of home cooking. UConn gets away with lots of bumps and over the backs under the basket. Regardless we had no answer for their easy layups in transition.
SGA was huffing and puffing all night. By the time she got down court to defend a UConn was putting it in the basket right under or around her.
Big question now is what will they take away from this game and how will they respond.
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11-22-2016, 09:07 PM
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We led in 3 categories:
Blocks 7 - 5
Fouls 20 - 15
Turnovers 15 - 9
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11-22-2016, 09:10 PM
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Originally Posted by jack72
Amen. They bump the dribbler every time down the floor, and has not been called once.
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Careful you'll get the wrath from UACflyer. He won't see it they way we did, against his beloved huskies and Geno.
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11-22-2016, 09:14 PM
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Disappointed in our bigs tonight. The lack of effort, hustle, willingness to play defense in transition, tear limbs off for rebounds, was one of the most collectively inept performances I have seen from a work ethic standpoint in several years. UConn's hefty bench butterball center beat our bigs down the court 2-3 times late in the game. It wasnt because she was faster. It was because she played harder. That toxicity must be purged from the bloodstream -- quickly.
Guards -- did all they realistically could. They had zero help and were asked to do way too much. They took care of the ball, did most of the scoring. They battled. Defensive rotations were weak, but much of that was because of our zone we had to go to because our bigs were defensive lawn ornaments. They were even beaten back-side in the zone for layups 5-6 times on pretty much the same baseline pass.
Good lessons learned tonight however. We have a long way to go but know where the strengths and weaknesses are. They may or may not be more profound than we thought, but at least there is no ambiguity.
Scaife and Giacone and Wilmoth are pups. Can't hold them to the same standard as everyone else. Last year they were playing St. Rita's HS. Now they are playing UConn. I see some optimism in all three. I like Scaife's quickness and dribble-driving ability. She must shoot better than Edwards however. Giacone has promise. She will need to rework her high dribble a bit however at the college level. Wilmoth like any big needs time. The frosh were not the issue tonight.
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11-22-2016, 09:19 PM
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We got exposed all over the court. Offensively we did nothing but dribble drive and throw up a wild shot or chuck a trey. Not a lot of sharing of the rock.
Defensively, we were inept. Most disappointed in our inability to get back on defense.
IMHOP - This UConn team is nowhere near the caliber of recent Husky teams - especially defensively. No Stewart or Jefferson out there.
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11-22-2016, 09:38 PM
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Chris you can give the freshmen a pass but why is it freshmen on other teams run circles around our. UConn freshmen are heads and tails above ours yet other peer teams have freshmen too and many of them either start or play significant minutes.
Don't think it was a mistake to play UConn nor do I feel that it devastated this team, just showed our strengths (did we have any ) and weaknesses. Its now up to each individual player to realize what it takes to be a top 25 team. No ifs ands or buts, each player has to step up or ride the pine.
Believe this team is still searching for its identity and confidence. For 3 quarters their were some moments especially the 3rd period where we showed we could play with them.....just not consistently.
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11-22-2016, 09:58 PM
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Back home....
....a little disappointed. We lost by 33; and UConn freshmen got a lot of 4th Q minutes.
You all saw the same game I did...just a large talent disparity. UConn likely will lose a game or two this season. But no more than that.
UConn players display a hunger for the ball displayed by no other team...no matter the score. I have often wondered how Auriemma gets his gals to play like that.
One question: Why didn't Austria play in the second half. To my eye the Flyers seemed more organized and stable when she was on the court.
Whatever, a good experience for the players....good exposure for the program.
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11-22-2016, 10:16 PM
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Win or not I support our team. We don't offen have these kind of challenges. The students learned tonight.
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11-22-2016, 10:25 PM
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We scheduled and got drubbed by a good tOSU team a few years back. IIRC, Coach said we would learn from it. And we actually did learn. Our players just had a chance to recalibrate where the bar is set for energy, tenacity, and skills by the best program in the world.
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11-22-2016, 10:46 PM
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I would like to see more home and away twice games with some of the better programs in the country. I think it would help with recruiting and with making us better.
I hope we learn from a game like this and that we actually go smaller and quicker. Start Austria, Burdette, Cannatelli, and Harris with Scaife.
Go Flyers!
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11-23-2016, 12:28 AM
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I understand the disappointment, but I guess I am surprised that many of you are surprised by the result. Every player on their team is better than every player on our team. Hustle matters and we lacked that. That is my biggest disappointment. You don't have to be good to give 100%.
Their coach has won more games than just about everyone. Ours has won two. Not sure if you noticed, but they have a few banners hanging from the ceiling. It will take a while before we can expect to be remotely competitive with them. Not too many teams are and none play in the A-10. This isn't men's basketball where you can become good fairly quickly. This will take a while.
It will be fun if/when they come to Dayton. Hopefully by then we are willing to compete for 40 minutes.
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11-23-2016, 12:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Avid Flyer
Chris you can give the freshmen a pass but why is it freshmen on other teams run circles around our. UConn freshmen are heads and tails above ours yet other peer teams have freshmen too and many of them either start or play significant minutes
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Well we do have the reigning A10 Rookie of the Year. I think its just a different level with Top-10 teams.
And its not a huge surprise that successful people tend to work harder than less successful people. Its like that in life and like that in sports. So yes while UConn has better talent at every position, part of being better talent is because they work harder than their peers. Steve Jobs was a genius, but Steve Jobs also worked 18-hr days for 20 years to realize his ceiling. Most people dont want to go that hard.
Geno gets the players that parlay great talent from an even greater drive to not want to fail. For others, the thought of failure is much less upsetting.
Dennis Rodman was a great rebounder. But he also worked the glass harder than anyone else as well. Put the two together and you had The Worm.
Shauna's challenge is to recalibrate the practices and in-game play so that what is now considered an acceptable level of effort will soon be considered outrageously unacceptable in the future. Right now some players take 1 of every 2 plays off. Eventually it needs to be 1 of every 10 plays, and when you sleep on 1 of every 5, you come out of the game. It will take time. You have to break them down before you rebuild them back up. It will probably get worse before it gets better.
Again, I thought the guards did as much as could humanly be expected under he circumstances against Parade All-Americans and no help from their frontcourt. No sense playing Burdette and Austria most of the 4th qtr. The game was over. Dont get injured. They have a Bahama trip coming up. Save them for that.
We more or less took care of the ball tonight. That's a positive.
Our bigs shot 0 FTs tonight. Zero. Unacceptable. UConn's frontcourt shot 31-52 for .600% from the floor. Unacceptable.
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11-23-2016, 08:00 AM
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At least on the UConn web site comments from Coach Green...
''I don't care about the score; I don't look at the scoreboard,'' said Green, who was an assistant until Jim Jabir resigned for personal reasons in September. ''That's all we've been preaching - you have to fight. It doesn't matter, just continue to play hard and with some energy and some passion.''
The Flyers are off to Bimini in the Bahamas for the Junkanoo Jam, where they will face Georgia Tech on Friday and then either Missouri or Creighton.
''That's three great teams from Power Five conferences,'' Green said. ''If we can get two wins down there, that just builds your resume for later on in March. I really want to see how we respond to this and see our mental toughness, see how we take this and use it to get better.''
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11-23-2016, 08:02 AM
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While its true our bigs shot zero FT tonight it is also true they were fouled but no calls. There was a disparity in foul calls but that would not in and of itself got UD the W but could have made the game more competitive keeping the loss in the 20's instead of the 30's.
UACflyer pointed out UConn played their freshmen in the 4th qtr and if he saw the same game UD also played their freshmen and non starters but he failed to mention that side of the story.
As for Austria not playing 2nd half, why take a chance on getting her hurt in a game we had little to no chance to get a W. Shauna did what she should have done and that is give everyone a shot at playing a top team like UConn. They all got a taste of what it is like and now know where they stand talent, energy, competitive wise. No one played outstanding, guards held their own but the bigs need to be developed and quickly.
To be honest I don't have a lot of confidence the bigs can be. SGA is a senior and is not going to become something she is not. Andi gives it what she has and tries to be a beast but still makes some silly mistakes. Can't figure out Maddy but so far she is 1 of 8 and 0 of 4 3 ptrs. Does have 10 rebounds (1-9) for 29 min.
As for our newcomers seems Harris and Scaife are our best hopes. Both talented and energized but not UConn caliber...yet.
Haven't seen much from Parkinson yet. Giacone got three 4th qtr min and held her own but didn't score.
All in all Shauna has tools to work with but as Chris stated it will take a lot to build this team up and could look awkward going forward as they get their roles defined and find where their strengths and weaknesses are.
The building blocks are their and its up to each one to step up their game. Future looks better than dim. Should be fun even if a little frustrating to watch this team mature.
Best of luck in the tournaments. Go Flyers!
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11-23-2016, 08:55 AM
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Usual shot...
Originally Posted by Avid Flyer
While its true our bigs shot zero FT tonight it is also true they were fouled but no calls. There was a disparity in foul calls but that would not in and of itself got UD the W but could have made the game more competitive keeping the loss in the 20's instead of the 30's.
UACflyer pointed out UConn played their freshmen in the 4th qtr and if he saw the same game UD also played their freshmen and non starters but he failed to mention that side of the story.As for Austria not playing 2nd half, why take a chance on getting her hurt in a game we had little to no chance to get a W. Shauna did what she should have done and that is give everyone a shot at playing a top team like UConn. They all got a taste of what it is like and now know where they stand talent, energy, competitive wise. No one played outstanding, guards held their own but the bigs need to be developed and quickly.
To be honest I don't have a lot of confidence the bigs can be. SGA is a senior and is not going to become something she is not. Andi gives it what she has and tries to be a beast but still makes some silly mistakes. Can't figure out Maddy but so far she is 1 of 8 and 0 of 4 3 ptrs. Does have 10 rebounds (1-9) for 29 min.
As for our newcomers seems Harris and Scaife are our best hopes. Both talented and energized but not UConn caliber...yet.
Haven't seen much from Parkinson yet. Giacone got three 4th qtr min and held her own but didn't score.
All in all Shauna has tools to work with but as Chris stated it will take a lot to build this team up and could look awkward going forward as they get their roles defined and find where their strengths and weaknesses are.
The building blocks are their and its up to each one to step up their game. Future looks better than dim. Should be fun even if a little frustrating to watch this team mature.
Best of luck in the tournaments. Go Flyers!
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Avid, I would be disappointed if you didn't miss the opportunity to take your usual shot at me.
With the exception of Austria and one or two others I don't even know who the Dayton players are. Unfortunately the programs provided at UConn games contain no information about the opponent.
Had I known that Green was playing subs and freshmen in the 4thQ I wouldn't have asked why Austria wasn't playing. I thought, perhaps, she was injured.
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11-23-2016, 09:07 AM
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Austria only played 15 minutes and it was not the old Kelley. She was either ill or something going on. Scaife has been shooting well up until last night, but that was some different defense. She is a freshmen that can play with that kind of talent.
Give Grant another couple of years and she will get stronger and be fine. Oh wait, we said that two years ago. Well at least she got a little stronger. Her lack of hustle for a senior is a bad signal to her teammates.
Green has a long way to go as a coach. She has to make this team learn some offense and defense, and get them to buy into giving 100%. We gave up about 18 offensive rebounds in three quarters, and were not smaller than them. Poor positioning, no blockouts, poor effort, and some poor calls. When you give up 98 points on 27 assists and 49% shooting with not great three point shooting, you stink on defense. A huge problem for Green is can she recruit a couple of big kids who can play. Sant would be a stud on this team. We need some 6'4" kids better than the current ones.
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11-23-2016, 09:10 AM
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Usual shot...
Originally Posted by Avid Flyer
While its true our bigs shot zero FT tonight it is also true they were fouled but no calls. There was a disparity in foul calls but that would not in and of itself got UD the W but could have made the game more competitive keeping the loss in the 20's instead of the 30's.
UACflyer pointed out UConn played their freshmen in the 4th qtr and if he saw the same game UD also played their freshmen and non starters but he failed to mention that side of the story.As for Austria not playing 2nd half, why take a chance on getting her hurt in a game we had little to no chance to get a W. Shauna did what she should have done and that is give everyone a shot at playing a top team like UConn. They all got a taste of what it is like and now know where they stand talent, energy, competitive wise. No one played outstanding, guards held their own but the bigs need to be developed and quickly.
To be honest I don't have a lot of confidence the bigs can be. SGA is a senior and is not going to become something she is not. Andi gives it what she has and tries to be a beast but still makes some silly mistakes. Can't figure out Maddy but so far she is 1 of 8 and 0 of 4 3 ptrs. Does have 10 rebounds (1-9) for 29 min.
As for our newcomers seems Harris and Scaife are our best hopes. Both talented and energized but not UConn caliber...yet.
Haven't seen much from Parkinson yet. Giacone got three 4th qtr min and held her own but didn't score.
All in all Shauna has tools to work with but as Chris stated it will take a lot to build this team up and could look awkward going forward as they get their roles defined and find where their strengths and weaknesses are.
The building blocks are their and its up to each one to step up their game. Future looks better than dim. Should be fun even if a little frustrating to watch this team mature.
Best of luck in the tournaments. Go Flyers!
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Avid, I would be disappointed if you didn't miss the opportunity to take your usual shot at me.
With the exception of Austria and one or two others I don't even know who the Dayton players are. Unfortunately the programs provided at UConn games contain no information about the opponent.
Had I known that Green was playing subs and freshmen in the 4thQ I wouldn't have asked why Austria wasn't playing. I thought, perhaps, she was injured.
As for holding Austria out for much of the game to avoid injury, I'm not sure I buy into that strategy in a game on a national stage. Players can be injured in any game at any stage of the game or in practice. I understand a cautious approach. But, KA played only 15 minutes...she was not pulled late in a game that was out of reach.
In my clearly uninformed opinion, the UConn game was not the game to keep your team leader and arguably best player on the bench while playing subs and freshmen.
The program was on display...it was not just another game. In my opinion, making a real effort to hold the final score to within 20 would have worthwhile.
Just opinion.
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11-23-2016, 11:23 AM
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General of the Air Force
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Originally Posted by Chris R
Few predictions: two turnovers in the first 90 seconds. close to 30 turnovers. Probably a final score of 89-47. Shoot around 29% from the floor. Commit lots of fouls. Killed on the boards. Probably a ton of UConn second chance points. It is what it is. There are no Malotts and Hoovers out there now.
UConn plays harder than any other team. They get the best players, but Geno gets them to play hard every play. Nobody else does that. Thats where they kill you. They expend more energy in the first 8 minutes than most teams will do in 40.
Whatever happens, it will be a net positive. The expectation starts at 0. If you do anything remotely solid, you walk away feeling really good.
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Great post chris. UConn does everything with passion and attention to detail. That is what you hope the team learns. Review the tape and show why u conn was so successful as an example.... When they throw a post pass it is to the correct shoulder and the post player protects the pass.
Last edited by UDBrian; 11-23-2016 at 11:26 AM..
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11-23-2016, 11:56 AM
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they play with pace ... all the time. The trick is he gets them to practice like that.
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11-23-2016, 03:26 PM
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Auriemma's comments...
Post game Auriemma remarks:
"When we play a team like Dayton we know what we're going to get. At schools like Dayton you're generally not going to get a Gabby Williams-type player or a Crystal Dangerfield-type player a lot of times. But you know you're going to have to face kids that are tough and are good with the ball and will make a lot of outside shots, whether you guard them or not".
"Dayton puts the pressure on you with their dribble. When they miss there's not a lot of people back on defense sometimes. We rebounded the ball better and got out in transition better and got some easy buckets that we didn't get against LSU and Baylor". (Obviosuly, this remark is a "teachable moment" for the Flyers.
The reports also mentioned that Flyers didn't have WNBA draft picks Ally Mallott and Andrea Hoover.
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11-23-2016, 03:52 PM
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General of the Air Force
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Originally Posted by UACFlyer
Avid, I would be disappointed if you didn't miss the opportunity to take your usual shot at me.
With the exception of Austria and one or two others I don't even know who the Dayton players are. Unfortunately the programs provided at UConn games contain no information about the opponent.
Had I known that Green was playing subs and freshmen in the 4thQ I wouldn't have asked why Austria wasn't playing. I thought, perhaps, she was injured.
As for holding Austria out for much of the game to avoid injury, I'm not sure I buy into that strategy in a game on a national stage. Players can be injured in any game at any stage of the game or in practice. I understand a cautious approach. But, KA played only 15 minutes...she was not pulled late in a game that was out of reach.
In my clearly uninformed opinion, the UConn game was not the game to keep your team leader and arguably best player on the bench while playing subs and freshmen.
The program was on display...it was not just another game. In my opinion, making a real effort to hold the final score to within 20 would have worthwhile.
Just opinion.
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Regarding Kelly Austria, Shauna Green stated before the season started that she would be using her sparingly until she is at full strength. And that also means mentally. Physically she is near 100% but after two acl she is not yet there mentally which is understandable
So the UCONN was consistent with her playing time in prior games.
As for taking shots at you its akin to UCONN continuing to drive the lane cause UD left the openings
Last edited by Avid Flyer; 11-23-2016 at 03:55 PM..
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Mad Props to Avid Flyer For This Totally Excellent Post:
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11-23-2016, 06:27 PM
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I dont think anyone cares whether you lost to UConn by 20 or 50. That's UConn's decision based on whether they call off the dogs or not. Nobody will read into a 20pt loss to UConn as a resume' net positive when its NCAA selection time. Too many in-game unknowns and nobody will know them to care. We were never going to win. But we could lose twice if we got a starter injured. Our season was never contingent on doing anything in this matchup. It was Thunderlips the Ultimate Male vs. the Italian Stallion. A novelty.
__________________
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Make everyone else's "one day" your "day one".
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11-23-2016, 07:19 PM
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General of the Air Force
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UACflyer in addition to Kelly, Shauna announced prior to season start that she would also be limiting time to Jenna and Lauren who both suffered shin splints last year due to having to play major roles for major minutes due to loss of Kelly, Amber and Edwards.
She wants to ease them back into the meat of the offense to avoid any further injuries. The season is a marathon and UD is not going to get top 25 recognition so best to pace critical players playing time for the A10 where it will count most.
Neither Shauna nor UD or any prider is trying to sell the decisions being made as excuses but considering the degree UD took last year in injuries I believe it is a prudent move to allow those players to regain their physical and mental toughness.
Reading and keeping up with the womens bball thread and the daytonflyers.com sites will give you more insight into the logic in limiting the players in the non conference games and getting them into condition for the league games and post season run.
No doubt their is a lot of work to be done but all things considered a 2-2 record at this juncture with only 1 home game isn't all that bad. All things considered. Shauna is looking to take two of three at the upcoming tournament. Of course a sweep of 3 would be great but baby steps for the new coach and her players.
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2 UDPriders Offer Mad Props to Avid Flyer For This Totally Excellent Post:
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11-23-2016, 07:51 PM
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General of the Air Force
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I think the Flyers are who we expected at this point in the season. They have strong guard play and need one or two bigs to step up and provide consistently strong play. If they don't get improved play from the bigs they are in trouble against strong teams, you don't have to be a great coach to know what the game plan will be for other teams.
For the short term future I really like the one young woman coming in next year. If Shauna can get a couple more players with those skill sets the future looks good
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Mad Props to UDBrian For This Totally Excellent Post:
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