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  #101  
Old 03-19-2017, 09:14 PM
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Rhody wins this I will have a new respect for D. Hurley.
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  #102  
Old 03-19-2017, 09:16 PM
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All tied up at 72. Matthews called for a charge. Hurley is about to lose it.
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  #103  
Old 03-19-2017, 09:20 PM
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Horrible ATO possession by Rhody leads to an Oregon steal.

Ducks drain a 3. Up 3 11 seconds left.

EC Matthews shoots an airball that would have tied it.

Oregon 75 Rhody 72 Final

Ducks finished on a 7-0 run to win it.
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  #104  
Old 03-19-2017, 09:22 PM
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Originally Posted by C-time View Post
All tied up at 72. Matthews called for a charge. Hurley is about to lose it.
Could have been a block. Feet were still shuffling a little, and he leaned into Matthews.
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  #105  
Old 03-19-2017, 09:22 PM
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Oregon should be a fun team to watch, but I don't enjoy it. Their players flop, they run their mouths, and they act like punks a lot.
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  #106  
Old 03-19-2017, 09:22 PM
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And Nike, er, Oregon beats Rhody.
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  #107  
Old 03-19-2017, 09:25 PM
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Originally Posted by T-Bone 84 View Post
Could have been a block. Feet were still shuffling a little, and he leaned into Matthews.
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Should've been a no call, but typical Hurley he dwells on it and his team loses. He just can't let bad calls go. They are a part of life.
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  #108  
Old 03-19-2017, 09:28 PM
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Don't worry my other team will kick their bleep on Thursday... Go Blue!
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  #109  
Old 03-19-2017, 09:29 PM
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Originally Posted by ruechalgrin View Post
This officiating crew actually calling travels on Wichita State.
Yes, but it's only because it's a Sunday...and they're playing a team from the P5.
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  #110  
Old 03-19-2017, 09:34 PM
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Originally Posted by priceg75 View Post
Should've been a no call, but typical Hurley he dwells on it and his team loses. He just can't let bad calls go. They are a part of life.
Lmao. Like Archie does? It was a terrible call.
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  #111  
Old 03-19-2017, 09:40 PM
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Originally Posted by BeckysTXA View Post
Just read a news report about Gregg Marshalls wife having the police visit her 3 times during the UK match because of her behavior. I was shocked. Apparently after the game was over they did escort her out. Yikes. It also made me realize we didn't hear or see anything of Morgan this NCAA tourney.
I just got back from the game and yes she was out of control. I have never seen a coaches wife even come close to how she was acting. Cursing, standing on the seat, just being flat out obnoxious! I heard that she was at the post game press conference and was complaining about the last block in the game saying it was a foul. I saw replays and it was all ball. Gregg Marshall might get another job offer but I wonder if it will have a stipulation that he doesn't bring his wife.
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  #112  
Old 03-19-2017, 09:47 PM
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Watching Duke vs. South Carolina. Grayson Allen goes up for a shot & gets fouled. The announcer described the foul saying Allen got slapped on the wrist. My response? "He should be used to that. It's all he ever gets."
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  #113  
Old 03-19-2017, 10:11 PM
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Yawn. What a boring tournament. Almost no good upsets. All March, no Madness. Call it March Madless. Unfortunately I think we may be getting a glimpse into the future of college basketball: Gonzaga is the only non-"power" conference team in the Sweet 16, and that's because they are a 1 seed. (Cincinnati still has a shot tonight).
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  #114  
Old 03-19-2017, 10:20 PM
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How about "March Blandness"?
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  #115  
Old 03-19-2017, 10:43 PM
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Duke on the ropes.
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  #116  
Old 03-19-2017, 10:53 PM
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Originally Posted by 312to937 View Post
Duke on the ropes.
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The one thing that can unite 99% of college basketball fans. Duke losing.
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  #117  
Old 03-19-2017, 10:55 PM
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Will be interesting to watch the whistles in the last 3 minutes
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  #118  
Old 03-19-2017, 10:58 PM
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And there we go.
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  #119  
Old 03-19-2017, 11:00 PM
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Originally Posted by 312to937 View Post
And there we go.
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And again!!!!
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  #120  
Old 03-19-2017, 11:03 PM
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I'm loving the crowd for this game. You've got the North Carolina fans cheering as hard for South Carolina as their own team.
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  #121  
Old 03-19-2017, 11:06 PM
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Wow. Didn't see this one coming.
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  #122  
Old 03-19-2017, 11:11 PM
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Bye bye duke
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  #123  
Old 03-19-2017, 11:23 PM
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Rhodey was up 72-68 and gave up a 4 point possession to let Oregon tie. Oregon makes a free throw, misses the second, and gets the rebound, misses a shot, gets another rebound, and then buries a three. Rhodey would have had a three point lead and the ball if they could get a rebound.
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  #124  
Old 03-20-2017, 12:16 AM
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Originally Posted by FlyerGuyer View Post
Yawn. What a boring tournament. Almost no good upsets. All March, no Madness. Call it March Madless. Unfortunately I think we may be getting a glimpse into the future of college basketball: Gonzaga is the only non-"power" conference team in the Sweet 16, and that's because they are a 1 seed. (Cincinnati still has a shot tonight).
The committee saw to it that the chances of that happening are zero to none. Why else would they have all the good non-P5 teams beat up on each other in the early rounds? they are doing their best to take all the fun out of the tournament.
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  #125  
Old 03-20-2017, 12:32 AM
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Originally Posted by frisco flyer View Post
The committee saw to it that the chances of that happening are zero to none. Why else would they have all the good non-P5 teams beat up on each other in the early rounds? they are doing their best to take all the fun out of the tournament.
They know where the money is.
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  #126  
Old 03-20-2017, 09:58 AM
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Silver Lining

1.) Syracuse getting left out for only winning 2 road games.
2.) Duke losing a "road" game to a 7 seed.
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  #127  
Old 03-20-2017, 12:44 PM
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What would have been even better is UNC losing. No ACC teams after the first weekend - priceless.

There have been a number of shall we say questionable calls - the worst of which have been no calls. The goal tend in the GU-NU game and the lack of a call in UNC-Ark. Looked like a charge, but it had to be something.
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  #128  
Old 03-20-2017, 01:00 PM
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Originally Posted by longtimefan View Post
Rhodey was up 72-68 and gave up a 4 point possession to let Oregon tie. Oregon makes a free throw, misses the second, and gets the rebound, misses a shot, gets another rebound, and then buries a three. Rhodey would have had a three point lead and the ball if they could get a rebound.
D*mn refs! Conspiracy!
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  #129  
Old 03-23-2017, 08:59 PM
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The Oregon Michigan game is great and the refs haven't even screwed it up yet.
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  #130  
Old 03-23-2017, 09:02 PM
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Great foul given up by Oregon to set their defense after the FT miss with fouls to give. That is a sign of a well coached team. They actually could have committed a couple more but chose not to.
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  #131  
Old 03-23-2017, 09:31 PM
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Michigan is unbelievable. They almost ran zero offense the entire game and still kept it close. Nothing but dribble drive till you are stopped from shooting, then pass to the closest open guy, who does more of the same. They took 31 threes, and fortunately hit 11. I have nothing against MI, but they are the antithesis of team basketball.
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  #132  
Old 03-23-2017, 09:57 PM
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Zags and Mountaineers tied with 1:59 to play. It's an ugly game but its close and competitive.
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  #133  
Old 03-23-2017, 10:01 PM
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This review is ridiculous. It's taking entirely too long.
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  #134  
Old 03-23-2017, 11:11 PM
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Originally Posted by C-time View Post
This review is ridiculous. It's taking entirely too long.
And the call itself was ridiculous. The ref was standing right on the end line and blew the call. But nothing new there.
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  #135  
Old 03-23-2017, 11:35 PM
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Is checking to see if the guy was in bounds a reviewable event? I thought they could only review who touched it last.... not whether the last touch was actually in bounds.... another strike against instant replay!
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Old 03-24-2017, 12:32 AM
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Archie sighting at the Arizona-eggxavier game.
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  #137  
Old 03-24-2017, 12:51 AM
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Chris Mack just took Sean Miller's lunch money in the last 4 minutes.
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  #138  
Old 03-24-2017, 12:55 AM
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lol that sucked

I wonder if Archie heads to Minneapolis on Saturday now
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  #139  
Old 03-24-2017, 01:04 AM
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Lauri Markannen took his last shot of the game with 11:12 left. That is inexcusable for Sean Miller to allow that to happen.
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  #140  
Old 03-24-2017, 01:17 AM
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Originally Posted by TerryK_67 View Post
Is checking to see if the guy was in bounds a reviewable event? I thought they could only review who touched it last.... not whether the last touch was actually in bounds.... another strike against instant replay!
They really stretched the rules. By calling it an "inadvertent whistle" possession then goes to the arrow. They were lucky the arrow was pointing to WVU - otherwise their only choice would have been to give it to the Zags. Obviously, the ball belonged to WVU.

I would not be surprised to see them tweak that rule in the future.
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Old 03-24-2017, 02:29 AM
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Three very close games tonight and a blowout. My takeaway: you need high-level recruits to compete and make these kinds of plays on any consistent basis. So many DNA-driven basketball plays out there by guys doing things with what God gave them. Coaching remained a part of it, but the coaching worked in part because the whiteboard was moving high-level chess pieces around.

You want to do something this deep in the tourney, you need dudes. Games like these are won in May and June and July at camps and in living rooms as much as they are in November practices. You can't shine a brown note.

Flyers got this far because we had a Top-40 prep star/transfer in Sibert, a high-level transfer in Vee, a totally overlooked gem like Dyshawn, and some very nice senior leadership. There is a reason Sibert hit shots out of his butt crack come tourney time (Syracuse 25 footer with 1min left, Boise kill shot): he had the DNA to do it. Guys like these make coaches look smarter.
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  #142  
Old 03-24-2017, 07:39 AM
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I agree that talent is absolutely necessary to get this far, but X beat an Arizona team significantly more talented than they are. I don't study the numbers but Arizona annually has one of the highest rated recruiting classes...so talented in fact, they lose players to the NBA early on a consistent basis. X usually garners a nice rated class, but no where near tops in the nation (2017 being an exception).

Coaching matters. X always scores or gets a great look coming out of a timeout. Mack has been masterful turning this season around. Unbelieveable.
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  #143  
Old 03-24-2017, 07:41 AM
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X has been bringing in great classes and next year is even better. Wonders of what making the tourney and joining a better conference can do
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  #144  
Old 03-24-2017, 07:42 AM
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And within 24 hours of losing will lose Chris Mack to Indiana. I hope Gonzaga wins by 50 and does all they can to embarrass them.
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  #145  
Old 03-24-2017, 07:47 AM
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Originally Posted by C-time View Post
Chris Mack just took Sean Miller's lunch money in the last 4 minutes.
And, to make it worse, I think he bought his lunch and made Miller carry the tray to the table where Mack was sitting with the cheerleaders and the homecoming queen.
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  #146  
Old 03-24-2017, 07:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Chris R View Post
....
you need high-level recruits to compete and make these kinds of plays on any consistent basis.
....
You want to do something this deep in the tourney, you need dudes....
IMHO the biggest component here has devolved into the 3 ball.... All the good teams have at least a couple of guys that nail them at any time, from any place, at a high percentage. No particular basketball teamwork or strategy... just rise up and jack the trey. Most of the time they are not "inside out", or a result of good passing and getting a team mate open. They are just "jacks". Michigan took 31 3's last night..... talk about live by the 3, die by the 3. They lost because they "only" hit 11.... probably lower percentage than they are used to. Now days, the trey is too easy a shot. Don't know if moving the line out will help or not, but they need to do something... maybe make the rim smaller???
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Old 03-24-2017, 07:55 AM
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I was going to say, it is nice to have dudes, it is also very nice to have good coaching. Put them together, and it's hard to beat.

I have seen so many jacks in the face of a dwindling game clock in this tournament, it is ridiculous. Why are there no buzzer beaters this year? Maybe because most of the last second shots have been long range contested 3's that had very little chance.

West Virginia's last possession was ridiculous. But it's been a pattern this year for sure.

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  #148  
Old 03-24-2017, 08:07 AM
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Originally Posted by C-time View Post
Chris Mack just took Sean Miller's lunch money in the last 4 minutes.
Last 8-9 minutes really. Zona' had no clue how to beat the zone. ZERO.Trier was the only reason AZ even scored....He got hot for about a 3-4 minute stretch hitting long range bombs, shots off the dribble and let his individual talents take over. Not once did they even try to find Markkanen or move him around to get the ball in conducive spots......Great idea to pay a coach the $$$ that they are paying Miller with the recruits he gets and he craps down his pants 2-3 games into the NCAA every year...
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  #149  
Old 03-24-2017, 08:19 AM
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Originally Posted by priceg75 View Post
...West Virginia's last possession was ridiculous...
I was watching it thinking, "Why don't they take the first good shot they see, and then play the 'foul them and extend the game' gambit?" That strategy certainly couldn't have worked any worse than the one they employed. Especially puzzling was when they got those two offensive boards in the last 25 seconds, and then instead of taking it right back up & trying to draw contact in the process, they kicked it back out and reran the same lousy sets that resulted in the lousy shots that resulted in the offensive rebounds in the first place. Very puzzling.
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  #150  
Old 03-24-2017, 08:34 AM
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II hate to say it, but you have to give Chris Mack his due. they are playing very well right now and have definitely figured out how to succeed without their PG at the right time. That said, Arizona's last 5 minutes last night was putrid. just wasting clock ad then chucking up bad or contested shots. that was a poor job by Sean Miller I thought.
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Old 03-24-2017, 09:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Chris R View Post
Three very close games tonight and a blowout. My takeaway: you need high-level recruits to compete and make these kinds of plays on any consistent basis. So many DNA-driven basketball plays out there by guys doing things with what God gave them. Coaching remained a part of it, but the coaching worked in part because the whiteboard was moving high-level chess pieces around.

You want to do something this deep in the tourney, you need dudes. Games like these are won in May and June and July at camps and in living rooms as much as they are in November practices. You can't shine a brown note.

Flyers got this far because we had a Top-40 prep star/transfer in Sibert, a high-level transfer in Vee, a totally overlooked gem like Dyshawn, and some very nice senior leadership. There is a reason Sibert hit shots out of his butt crack come tourney time (Syracuse 25 footer with 1min left, Boise kill shot): he had the DNA to do it. Guys like these make coaches look smarter.
Chris Mack is a very good coach. Give him his due too. Also, I think it is depth. We see it in A10. Some teams can put 5 on the floor but nobody to bring in off the bench. UD is usually better than their A10 brethren. However when it comes to playing with the big boys we are over matched. Think about it, X lost their starting pg and look where they are. Where would we be?
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  #152  
Old 03-24-2017, 09:48 AM
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It has become a guards game shooting long range, or driving to the the basket, and that is because the top teams all have bigs who are physical and can take up space, so they negate each other in the little space around the basket. If you don't have the guards, like Kansas and X and Gonzaga and WV, you end up like Purdue with your big guys not being able to get it done, because the teams at that level have horses who stop them.

Some people disagreed with me when I said X was way ahead of us in talent. That team has only one senior who contributes, will get Sumner back, and some great recruits. We meanwhile have little back and have some great recruits. The BE has made a difference recruiting for X and most of their teams. They are getting thoroughbreds under the basket, while we get trotters. Meanwhile the A10 plays musical coach.

Bottom line, we better get some big physical kids to nullify the space under the basket, or all the great guards in the world will not help us compete at the level we saw last night or last Friday.
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  #153  
Old 03-24-2017, 09:50 AM
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They lost their true starting PG from last year/this year in Davis AND their best player in Sumner..
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  #154  
Old 03-24-2017, 09:52 AM
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I hate watching Xavier.

I really, really hate seeing Bill Murray after every basket.
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Old 03-24-2017, 09:54 AM
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Originally Posted by jack72 View Post
It has become a guards game shooting long range, or driving to the the basket, and that is because the top teams all have bigs who are physical and can take up space, so they negate each other in the little space around the basket. If you don't have the guards, like Kansas and X and Gonzaga and WV, you end up like Purdue with your big guys not being able to get it done, because the teams at that level have horses who stop them.

Some people disagreed with me when I said X was way ahead of us in talent. That team has only one senior who contributes, will get Sumner back, and some great recruits. We meanwhile have little back and have some great recruits. The BE has made a difference recruiting for X and most of their teams. They are getting thoroughbreds under the basket, while we get trotters. Meanwhile the A10 plays musical coach.

Bottom line, we better get some big physical kids to nullify the space under the basket, or all the great guards in the world will not help us compete at the level we saw last night or last Friday.
If they disagreed with you in regards to talent it's only because they despise them and simply can't/won't/refuse to say anything good about them. They've had better talent for years...
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Old 03-24-2017, 10:06 AM
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Originally Posted by rollo View Post
I hate watching Xavier.

I really, really hate seeing Bill Murray after every basket.
Ditto.

Get ready for more tonight with LaVar Ball!
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Old 03-24-2017, 10:34 AM
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Originally Posted by rollo View Post
I hate watching Xavier.

I really, really hate seeing Bill Murray after every basket.
Yeah, it happens so regularly it's like Groundhog Day....

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Old 03-24-2017, 10:40 AM
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I will also say that UD is not as far off as some of the comments come across (at least to me). We were seriously depleted in the front court all season, not for reasons that have anything to do with getting capable players at that position. I know much of the NCAA is about guard play, but they all seem to have some size down low as well. it happens, and the past couple of years it has happened to us. I don't see the lack of advancing this year as a differencein talent at UD compared to the elite 8 team. it's just that team was able to finish the season 100% intact and healthy. this year we were not. But for three seasons, we have absorbed some serious body blows but still have managed to be a top 30 or so program. Now it's on to some serious development over the summer and what looks to be a talented crew of freshmen coming in.
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Old 03-24-2017, 10:45 AM
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Originally Posted by rollo View Post
I hate watching Xavier.

I really, really hate seeing Bill Murray after every basket.
Combine Xavier's run with the Cubs' run to the World Series title and it's probably Murray's most sustained TV presence since his days on Saturday Night Live.
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Old 03-24-2017, 10:49 AM
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Originally Posted by steve View Post
Last 8-9 minutes really. Zona' had no clue how to beat the zone. ZERO.Trier was the only reason AZ even scored....He got hot for about a 3-4 minute stretch hitting long range bombs, shots off the dribble and let his individual talents take over. Not once did they even try to find Markkanen or move him around to get the ball in conducive spots......Great idea to pay a coach the $$$ that they are paying Miller with the recruits he gets and he craps down his pants 2-3 games into the NCAA every year...
I don't think it's fair to suggest Sean Miller "crapped down his pants" or was even out coached. Heck, Trier's last shot was halfway down. If that goes in, I am not sure there's a single post or article about Mack's genius or Miller's incompetence. No, instead they're talking about Miller's chance to finally break through and get to the FF in an epic battle with Gonzaga Saturday night.

In the end, Xavier's guys made the big plays. Hate them all you want, but Xavier remains a model program for the small, private Catholic institutions. I love Dayton and the progress we've made as a program and won't dare suggest that X is everything we aspire to be. But X's success has been extremely impressive I hope we can share a similar level of success in the near future.
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Old 03-24-2017, 11:00 AM
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Originally Posted by T-Bone 84 View Post
I was watching it thinking, "Why don't they take the first good shot they see, and then play the 'foul them and extend the game' gambit?" That strategy certainly couldn't have worked any worse than the one they employed. Especially puzzling was when they got those two offensive boards in the last 25 seconds, and then instead of taking it right back up & trying to draw contact in the process, they kicked it back out and reran the same lousy sets that resulted in the lousy shots that resulted in the offensive rebounds in the first place. Very puzzling.
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The possession couldn't have been any worse. The first 2 threes they took were not good at all. Once they got the second offensive rebound and set up with 12/13 seconds to go, they probably had to focus on getting a three, but certainly had time to drive and kick to create it. My biggest issue was with the first two shots and shot selection. Get it to the rim and try to get the deuce, maybe a traditional 3 point play, but if not they have the best turnover creating defense in the country and still probably 20-25 seconds to go and to play for a turnover for 3-5 seconds and then foul.
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Old 03-24-2017, 11:08 AM
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Originally Posted by AC91 View Post
II hate to say it, but you have to give Chris Mack his due. they are playing very well right now and have definitely figured out how to succeed without their PG at the right time. That said, Arizona's last 5 minutes last night was putrid. just wasting clock ad then chucking up bad or contested shots. that was a poor job by Sean Miller I thought.
Mack deserves credit for developing his coaching style beyond Sean Miller's system that he learned from. The Miller mantra is that we have a system(Man to Man D) and we will run it to beat you. Mack used that same system at the start of his tenure, but he has evolved to where he will change defenses and use zones now too. This is the only thing I hope Archie is willing to do at some point ,but I have my doubts if he ever will.

PS: Don't tell me that he played zone when UD has 6.5 players. That was out of pure necessity and he hasn't done it since then.
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Old 03-24-2017, 11:09 AM
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Originally Posted by SLUFLYER View Post
I don't think it's fair to suggest Sean Miller "crapped down his pants" or was even out coached. Heck, Trier's last shot was halfway down. If that goes in, I am not sure there's a single post or article about Mack's genius or Miller's incompetence. No, instead they're talking about Miller's chance to finally break through and get to the FF in an epic battle with Gonzaga Saturday night.

In the end, Xavier's guys made the big plays. Hate them all you want, but Xavier remains a model program for the small, private Catholic institutions. I love Dayton and the progress we've made as a program and won't dare suggest that X is everything we aspire to be. But X's success has been extremely impressive I hope we can share a similar level of success in the near future.
Did you even watch the final shot? It was not halfway down nor close but hit the front/back part of the rim and bounced several feet out front above the rim. It was the same terrible ,unopen-type fallaway miss that mimicked several outside shots they put up the last several minutes of the game with ZERO acumen by the players and especially the coaching staff to even have an idea how to play an inside/outside game, flash into the paint or to even get a touch deep into the post. Stagnant offense.Yes, it's a little different shot at that juncture but, again, Miller had ZERO ammunition in solving the zone, had an 8 point lead , and it was "his" guys that acted like they were down 8.

Sorry to burst your bubble here but that's how coaches that get hired by top tier schools, making millions of dollars with top 5 recruiting classes get measured and especially playing the last team that made the tourney and he failed again due to mainly terrible coaching and adjustments.
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Old 03-24-2017, 11:11 AM
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Originally Posted by CE80 View Post
Chris Mack is a very good coach. Give him his due too. Also, I think it is depth. We see it in A10. Some teams can put 5 on the floor but nobody to bring in off the bench. UD is usually better than their A10 brethren. However when it comes to playing with the big boys we are over matched. Think about it, X lost their starting pg and look where they are. Where would we be?
Gotta give Archie and staff a lot and I MEAN A LOT of credit. We have played small ball and/or short handed for the majority of time he has been HC.

An example was that "walk on" that was thrown in the mix under dire conditions.

But I agree you need some BIG boys and a solid bench to advance in the NCAAt.

Unfortunately we lost some of the guys one way or another, some because of stupidity, or through injury and of course due to fate being unkind.
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  #165  
Old 03-24-2017, 11:12 AM
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more fake news

Originally Posted by MikeF View Post
Combine Xavier's run with the Cubs' run to the World Series title and it's probably Murray's most sustained TV presence since his days on Saturday Night Live.
I especially hate all the talk about Murray being the 'biggest Xavier fan'...what a bunch of BS. He's a carpetbagger, and once his kid moves to another school, Bill will follow and never be seen in Norwood again.

http://ftw.usatoday.com/2017/03/bill...-march-madness
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Old 03-24-2017, 11:35 AM
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Amazing run for X considering for a 9 game stretch at the end of the season they looked like they couldn't have beat NKU and were lucky they played Depaul twice instead of just about anyone else in the BE just to make it in. Maryland was a good matchup for them and gave them some confidence. Florida State was a 3 seed that didn't scare many people. And now Bluet is healthy again. Hate seeing them win but I think they match up well with Gonzaga too. Get in, get good matchups, and get hot - someone does it every year.
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Old 03-24-2017, 11:54 AM
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Originally Posted by steve View Post
Did you even watch the final shot? It was not halfway down nor close but hit the front/back part of the rim and bounced several feet out front above the rim. It was the same terrible ,unopen-type fallaway miss that mimicked several outside shots they put up the last several minutes of the game with ZERO acumen by the players and especially the coaching staff to even have an idea how to play an inside/outside game, flash into the paint or to even get a touch deep into the post. Stagnant offense.Yes, it's a little different shot at that juncture but, again, Miller had ZERO ammunition in solving the zone, had an 8 point lead , and it was "his" guys that acted like they were down 8.

Sorry to burst your bubble here but that's how coaches that get hired by top tier schools, making millions of dollars with top 5 recruiting classes get measured and especially playing the last team that made the tourney and he failed again due to mainly terrible coaching and adjustments.
Yeah, I watched it. Like 5 times last night. And just watched it again 3 times because your post had me doubting myself and that I was thinking of the West Virginia game, but they didn't even get a shot off. Yes, the shot is pretty darn close to going in. I don't particularly care for the shot selection or the depth of that three, but the dude did score 15 straight to get Zona an 8 point lead.

So Miller had no ammunition to thwart the zone and the comeback? Then who had the ammunition to get Zona the 8 point lead?

I just don't think the crucifixion that Sean Miller is taking on this board is a reasonable assessment.

I hate to burst your bubble, but the standard you seem to set for success vs failure is that if you win, you're great. If you lose, you failed. 350 coaches this year will fail, Archie included. Archie was outcoached by Gregg Marshall. He was outcoached by Boeheim last year. Heck, he was outcoached by a fired Derek Kellogg just 8 weeks ago. I really wish Archie would quit failing us every year.

The fact that Sean Miller lost to Xavier, "one of the last teams to make the tourney", doesn't make him any less of a coach. Coaches are measured on a very fine line, usually by the result of something that someone else (a 19 or 20 year old) is doing. If Trier's shot is just an inch longer, it goes in and Sean Miller is the toast of the town for another 48 hours.
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Old 03-24-2017, 12:30 PM
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Talking

Originally Posted by rollo View Post
I hate watching Xavier.

I really, really hate seeing Bill Murray after every basket.
On the flip side, I thoroughly enjoyed watching that Macy's balloon Huggins getting worked up over how tight the game was called...after every whistle turning to the NCAA officials sitting near his bench and bi***ing up a storm.
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  #169  
Old 03-24-2017, 12:39 PM
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Xavier beat the opponents in their path so congratulations to Xavier.

Objectively, they have had one of the easier paths to an Elite 8 ever, particularly due to the fact that they beat three teams that were seeded materially too high (6, 3, 2 seeds that should have been seeded 11, 6, and 5). This is a Committee issue as the teams they beat were all materially overseeded.

They beat #43 Maryland, #24 FL St., & #18 AZ to reach Elite 8 (kenpom #s at time of game). Maryland should have been a 11 seed (but was a 6), FL St should have been a 6 seed (but was a 3), Arizona should have been a 5 seed (but was a 2). Total of kenpom ranks 85 collectively (43 + 24 + 18). Also a 6% chance to reach the Elite 8 (50.7% chance to beat Maryland, 33.7% chance to beat FL St, and 34.6% chance to beat Arizona). 17% chance to beat Gonzaga to reach Final 4.

Just to contrast that with Dayton's Elite 8 run. Flyers beat #19 Ohio State seeded 6 (should have been 4 seed), beat #13 Syracuse seeded 3 (should have been 4 seed), and #34 Stanford seeded 10 (should have been 9 seed). Total of kenpom ranks 66 (19 + 13 + 34). 4% chance to reach the Elite 8 (33.8% chance to beat Ohio State, 28.8% chance to beat Syracuse, and 43.7% chance to beat Stanford). 16% to chance to beat FL to reach Final 4.

Again, congratulations to Xavier as they the teams who the Committee puts in front of them, but I have been calling Xavier to the Sweet 16 since the Committee announced its bracket as the Committee royally messed up in West seeding. Objectively, as an 11 seed, they had to beat a 11 seed, 6 seed, and 5 seed (if seeded correctly) to reach the Elite 8. Committee was terrible in seeding for the West.
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Old 03-24-2017, 12:41 PM
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Originally Posted by ruechalgrin View Post
Xavier beat the opponents in their path so congratulations to Xavier.
What is Gonzaga's Kenpom rating? #1?


http://kenpom.com

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Old 03-24-2017, 12:54 PM
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Wow, Kansas looked very, very good last night. Wonder if they are that great, or it was just a great matchup against the PU inferior guards?
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Old 03-24-2017, 01:42 PM
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Originally Posted by AC91 View Post
I will also say that UD is not as far off as some of the comments come across (at least to me). We were seriously depleted in the front court all season, not for reasons that have anything to do with getting capable players at that position. I know much of the NCAA is about guard play, but they all seem to have some size down low as well. it happens, and the past couple of years it has happened to us. I don't see the lack of advancing this year as a differencein talent at UD compared to the elite 8 team. it's just that team was able to finish the season 100% intact and healthy. this year we were not. But for three seasons, we have absorbed some serious body blows but still have managed to be a top 30 or so program. Now it's on to some serious development over the summer and what looks to be a talented crew of freshmen coming in.
You give us a healthy Josh and Steve...and I agree....UD isn't far off in terms of having a first 5 and 4 guys on the bench that can give you + minutes.

I think the with an average PG, Josh/Steve and recruits coming in, we end up in really good shape. Now, it is a toss up. And...did the firing of two players from UD have any impact on future recruiting and recruits that we did have? I don't know...or does Archie just go for the best guys he can get...no matter what holes the starting 5 may have.
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Old 03-24-2017, 01:48 PM
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Originally Posted by C-time View Post
Great foul given up by Oregon to set their defense after the FT miss with fouls to give. That is a sign of a well coached team. They actually could have committed a couple more but chose not to.
I thought Oregon should have fouled 2 more times on Michigan's last posession, in order to waste more time. Oregon only had 4 fouls.

Only 4 fouls on Oregon again in the 2nd half. This also happened vs. Rhode Island.

I am starting to wonder if the fix is in for Oregon.

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Old 03-24-2017, 01:58 PM
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Originally Posted by AC91 View Post
II hate to say it, but you have to give Chris Mack his due. they are playing very well right now and have definitely figured out how to succeed without their PG at the right time. That said, Arizona's last 5 minutes last night was putrid. just wasting clock ad then chucking up bad or contested shots. that was a poor job by Sean Miller I thought.
Arizona jacked up too many 3's IMO.

No doubt though, X is very hot right now, and Mack is pushing all the right buttons.

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Old 03-24-2017, 02:08 PM
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X played **** near a Villanova against Georgetown 1985 game. Huge credit to the team, but I don't see how they can do it every game.
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Old 03-24-2017, 02:25 PM
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Originally Posted by OCFlyer85 View Post
X played **** near a Villanova against Georgetown 1985 game.
It wasn't even close to a Nova like performance. Xavier shot 53% from the field and 69% from the foul line, with 8 turnovers. 1985 Nova shot 77% from the field and 82% from the foul line (turnovers not available).

And it's not like Xavier tore up from behind the arc either, just 6-16.
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Old 03-24-2017, 02:36 PM
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Originally Posted by ruechalgrin View Post
Xavier beat the opponents in their path so congratulations to Xavier.
So, if Kenpom #30 Xavier, the worst Kenpom team left in the field of 12 teams, beats Kenpom #1 Gonzaga, will that be seen as a knock against the accuracy of the Kenpom ratings?
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Old 03-24-2017, 02:40 PM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
I thought Oregon should have fouled 2 more times on Michigan's last posession, in order to waste more time. Oregon only had 4 fouls.

Only 4 fouls on Oregon again in the 2nd half. This also happened vs. Rhode Island.

I am starting to wonder if the fix is in for Oregon.
And Altman said his players made a mistake by not fouling again...so maybe not so well coached???
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Old 03-24-2017, 02:53 PM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
So, if Kenpom #30 Xavier, the worst Kenpom team left in the field of 12 teams, beats Kenpom #1 Gonzaga, will that be seen as a knock against the accuracy of the Kenpom ratings?
It's my understanding that the more upsets that happen, based on KenPom rankings, the bigger the "knock" against KenPom. His rankings are predictive, so if his rankings only produce a 50% success ratio, then yeah, they would/should and could be questioned.
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Old 03-24-2017, 03:05 PM
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referring to the 85 Nova game, I meant primarily that guys who hadn't done much all year suddenly were clutch. Who the @#$!@# is this Bernard guy?
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Old 03-24-2017, 03:59 PM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
Arizona jacked up too many 3's IMO.

No doubt though, X is very hot right now, and Mack is pushing all the right buttons.
Arizona #19th in the nation in 3 point percentage at 39%. Shot 25.9% for the game. 3s have such a high variance game to game. Was at the game live and the looks were mostly wide-open, they just missed.

+7 possessions for the game and lose. Story was +9 possessions in 1H up by only 2. Arizona was -2 on possession in 2H so great job in 2H on limiting turnovers and grabbing more offensive rebounds.

Gonzaga #1 in country in kenpom in 2017; FL was #1 in country in kenpom when Dayton played them.
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Old 03-24-2017, 04:04 PM
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Dayton mentioned in article about 1x NCAA payment.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports...onus/99582450/
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Old 03-24-2017, 04:31 PM
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In 2014, Dayton played their first two games in Columbus, basically home games for you guys. In the S16, you played in Memphis, against Stanford who had to travel all the way across the country.

Dayton also played a home game against Boise St. in the First Four to advance one year.

Fact: The only NCAA tournament team Wichita St. beat all year was Dayton.

I like KenPom, but Xavier is a talented team, even without Sumner. Bluiett, Macura, Goodin, Jones, Gates, were all 4 star recruits or Top 100 kids. Xavier is playing with a true freshman at PG.

Trying to soley use KenPom to see who has had a tougher path in the NCAA tournament is ridiculous.

Dayton made the Elite Eight in '14. No one cares how you did it. You got there and it's a heck of an accomplishment.
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Old 03-24-2017, 05:29 PM
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Originally Posted by XFactor View Post
In 2014, Dayton played their first two games in Columbus, basically home games for you guys. In the S16, you played in Memphis, against Stanford who had to travel all the way across the country.

Dayton also played a home game against Boise St. in the First Four to advance one year.

Fact: The only NCAA tournament team Wichita St. beat all year was Dayton.

I like KenPom, but Xavier is a talented team, even without Sumner. Bluiett, Macura, Goodin, Jones, Gates, were all 4 star recruits or Top 100 kids. Xavier is playing with a true freshman at PG.

Trying to soley use KenPom to see who has had a tougher path in the NCAA tournament is ridiculous.

Dayton made the Elite Eight in '14. No one cares how you did it. You got there and it's a heck of an accomplishment.
Lie: In 2014, Dayton played its first two games in Columbus.

Fact: In 2014, Dayton payed its first two game in Buffalo including basically an away game versus Syracuse. Although Dayton had 2,000 fans in attendance, Syracuse probably had 18,000.

Fact: Beating #18 Arizona was the first top 20 kenpom win for Xavier in the NCAA Tournament since 2010 and only second top 40 win (other #24 FL St.) since 2010! During that time Xavier got to multiple Sweet 16 without ever beating a top 40 kenpom team. Fact, that is really lucky!

Fact: Dayton has 5 top 40 kenpom wins since 2010 in the NCAA and has 2 top 20 wins.

I could go and on here, but sorry man, but you are making stuff up.

Xaiver had an extremely easy path to the Sweet 16, I believe it was the easiest path ever (at least since 2002 when kenpom came to existence). Dayton had the most difficult path with Wichita State and then would have been Kentucky. Said it when the draw was released and continue to say it now.

Will be impressed if Xavier beats Gonzaga, that is a true top 15 team. But again congrats on the trip to the Elite 8.
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Old 03-24-2017, 07:43 PM
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UNC is blowing out Butler by 14 in the first half. After watching everyone play, Kansas and UNC are the class of the tourney, but someone gets hot and they get cold, and upsets happen.
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Old 03-24-2017, 07:46 PM
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Absolutely no defense in that game. Horrible basketball.
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Old 03-24-2017, 07:54 PM
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Originally Posted by ruechalgrin View Post
Lie: In 2014, Dayton played its first two games in Columbus.

Fact: In 2014, Dayton payed its first two game in Buffalo including basically an away game versus Syracuse. Although Dayton had 2,000 fans in attendance, Syracuse probably had 18,000.

Fact: Beating #18 Arizona was the first top 20 kenpom win for Xavier in the NCAA Tournament since 2010 and only second top 40 win (other #24 FL St.) since 2010! During that time Xavier got to multiple Sweet 16 without ever beating a top 40 kenpom team. Fact, that is really lucky!

Fact: Dayton has 5 top 40 kenpom wins since 2010 in the NCAA and has 2 top 20 wins.

I could go and on here, but sorry man, but you are making stuff up.

Xaiver had an extremely easy path to the Sweet 16, I believe it was the easiest path ever (at least since 2002 when kenpom came to existence). Dayton had the most difficult path with Wichita State and then would have been Kentucky. Said it when the draw was released and continue to say it now.

Will be impressed if Xavier beats Gonzaga, that is a true top 15 team. But again congrats on the trip to the Elite 8.
You're right, it was in '15, you guys played a home game in the First Four and then played PC in Columbus, another "home" game an hour from Dayton.

Talk about fortunate.

So now you (Dayton) measure NCAA tournament success by kenpom rankings? Sounds about right.

Only a Dayton fan could try and spin Xavier success. If only Dayton had had X's path, you guys would be right here too...

Again, Dayton was the only NCAA tournament team that Wichita St. beat ALL YEAR. They're lucky they got paired with Dayton who had lost their last two games to GW and Davidson.
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Old 03-24-2017, 07:59 PM
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Originally Posted by XFactor View Post
You're right, it was in '15, you guys played a home game in the First Four and then played PC in Columbus, another "home" game an hour from Dayton.

Talk about fortunate.

So now you (Dayton) measure NCAA tournament success by kenpom rankings? Sounds about right.

Only a Dayton fan could try and spin Xavier success. If only Dayton had had X's path, you guys would be right here too...

Again, Dayton was the only NCAA tournament team that Wichita St. beat ALL YEAR. They're lucky they got paired with Dayton who had lost their last two games to GW and Davidson.
Don't lump us all in, we don't all bow at the KenPom altar...

Last edited by CT Flyer; 03-24-2017 at 09:01 PM..
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Old 03-24-2017, 08:15 PM
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Originally Posted by XFactor View Post
You're right, it was in '15, you guys played a home game in the First Four and then played PC in Columbus, another "home" game an hour from Dayton.

Talk about fortunate.

So now you (Dayton) measure NCAA tournament success by kenpom rankings? Sounds about right.

Only a Dayton fan could try and spin Xavier success. If only Dayton had had X's path, you guys would be right here too...

Again, Dayton was the only NCAA tournament team that Wichita St. beat ALL YEAR. They're lucky they got paired with Dayton who had lost their last two games to GW and Davidson.
Wichita State will be a top 10 preseason team, write it down now.

Measure by NCAA which Xavier has had in 2017, they beat who they faced in the tournament.

But the Committee was a dumpster fire in seeding the West.

And yeah I think Dayton beats both Maryland and FL State, but loses last night to Arizona. I said when the brackets were released, I would love to have Xavier's or Rhode Island's draws. But Xavier got the easy draw and took advantage of it (Dayton had the easy draw in 2016 and did not take advantage of it).
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Old 03-24-2017, 08:35 PM
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Originally Posted by XFactor View Post
You're right, it was in '15, you guys played a home game in the First Four and then played PC in Columbus, another "home" game an hour from Dayton.

Talk about fortunate.

So now you (Dayton) measure NCAA tournament success by kenpom rankings? Sounds about right.

Only a Dayton fan could try and spin Xavier success. If only Dayton had had X's path, you guys would be right here too...

Again, Dayton was the only NCAA tournament team that Wichita St. beat ALL YEAR. They're lucky they got paired with Dayton who had lost their last two games to GW and Davidson.
Congrats on getting to the Elite 8 Xfactor. Go back to your own message boards. You haven't posted here since 2015 and are just here to troll people.

And btw GO ZAGS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 03-24-2017, 09:23 PM
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Originally Posted by ruechalgrin View Post
Wichita State will be a top 10 preseason team, write it down now.

Measure by NCAA which Xavier has had in 2017, they beat who they faced in the tournament.

But the Committee was a dumpster fire in seeding the West.

And yeah I think Dayton beats both Maryland and FL State, but loses last night to Arizona. I said when the brackets were released, I would love to have Xavier's or Rhode Island's draws. But Xavier got the easy draw and took advantage of it (Dayton had the easy draw in 2016 and did not take advantage of it).
Dayton wasn't likely to beat either MD or FS. We peaked early. We got drilled by GW and only another miracle comeback kept us from being embarresed even more than losing in the first game of the A10 to middle of the pack team that played the day before. We had a really nice run, but COLLAPSED down the stretch. Wonder why?
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Old 03-24-2017, 09:43 PM
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Originally Posted by maddog07 View Post
Dayton wasn't likely to beat either MD or FS. We peaked early. We got drilled by GW and only another miracle comeback kept us from being embarresed even more than losing in the first game of the A10 to middle of the pack team that played the day before. We had a really nice run, but COLLAPSED down the stretch. Wonder why?
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Wonder why, Maddog? We lacked the inside presence to compete with teams that had bigger athletic 4/5s. Pollard and X did the best they could, but when you don't have a legitimate big man, the opposition's bigs killed us on both sides of the court. Hopefully the new bigs coming in next year will help us out. Also, Charles Cooke picked his last game to have what was arguably the worst of his two years here at UD.
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Old 03-24-2017, 10:51 PM
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Originally Posted by C-time View Post
Congrats on getting to the Elite 8 Xfactor. Go back to your own message boards. You haven't posted here since 2015 and are just here to troll people.

And btw GO ZAGS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I'm not trying to troll. I just think it's ridiculous to try and downplay getting to the Elite 8 when a team beats a 6, 3, and 2 seed.

I don't care who you play in the NCAA tournament, it's never "easy" to advance.

One more note about Wichita State. Last year, they were ranked 13th by KenPom and received an 11 seed. They lost in the second round. This year, they were ranked 8th by KenPom and received a 10 seed. They lost in the second round.

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Old 03-24-2017, 11:13 PM
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Originally Posted by XFactor View Post
I'm not trying to troll. I just think it's ridiculous to try and downplay getting to the Elite 8 when a team beats a 6, 3, and 2 seed.

I don't care who you play in the NCAA tournament, it's never "easy" to advance.

One more note about Wichita State. Last year, they were ranked 13th by KenPom and received an 11 seed. They lost in the second round. This year, they were ranked 8th by KenPom and received a 10 seed. They lost in the second round.
You are absolutely trying to troll when you haven't posted on this board in 2 years. What other reason do you have to post here or even bother reading this board after getting to the Elite 8. Go back to Norwood.
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Old 03-25-2017, 12:29 AM
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Wisconsin!!!
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Old 03-25-2017, 12:48 AM
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Canyon Berry with the block!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Old 03-25-2017, 12:57 AM
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Wow. That shot was almost from the free throw line when he let it go. That's two of those in the same game and I don't remember ever seeing that before.
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Old 03-25-2017, 01:06 AM
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That was a hell of a basketball game.
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Old 03-25-2017, 04:12 AM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
I thought Oregon should have fouled 2 more times on Michigan's last posession, in order to waste more time. Oregon only had 4 fouls.

Only 4 fouls on Oregon again in the 2nd half. This also happened vs. Rhode Island.

I am starting to wonder if the fix is in for Oregon.
Been saying the same thing since watching the 2nd half of the Oregon/Rhody game last Sunday. To have been whistled for only 4 fouls for much of the 2nd half in 1 game? OK, maybe the opponent just isn't really good enough at drawing contact. But in consecutive games in the NCAA tournament? I tend to think Nike $ is having an influence on these outcomes.

That's just mere speculation on my part, mind you. But if it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then there's a pretty good chance that it's a duck (and yes, I know that's Oregon's mascot). It will be interesting to see how many times the whistle blows against them today, when they face #1 Seed Kansas (in Kansas City) instead of #14 Seed Iona, #11 Seed Rhode Island or #7 Seed Michigan.
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Old 03-25-2017, 10:56 AM
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The much basketball maligned SEC with 3 teams left, while the B10 has zero and ACC and BE one. Two of the eight do not play football.

Watching all of both games, it appeared to me that KY handled UCLA more easily than WSU. UCLA plays inconsistent defense, and launches up some silly threes.
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