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  #101  
Old 03-25-2017, 07:50 PM
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Originally Posted by MikeFlyer View Post
How bout johnny davis
see response #73 on this thread.
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  #102  
Old 03-25-2017, 08:30 PM
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After thinking on it for a bit I would be happy with Tommy Amaker
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  #103  
Old 03-25-2017, 08:41 PM
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Not that we need any more reasons to drink, but this little gem from MidMajorMadness.com (hate that that website even gives us press) will make you reach for the Jack (straight, no Coke).

Spoiler Alert: Jeff Boals is on the list

http://www.midmajormadness.com/2017/...ne-fife-flyers
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  #104  
Old 03-25-2017, 08:42 PM
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Originally Posted by NCkevi View Post
After thinking on it for a bit I would be happy with Tommy Amaker
Amaker is intriguing but his name is pretty prominent in the Georgetown search along with Brey and Smart. I would think he is going to let that play out and may have his sights set at a higher conference.
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  #105  
Old 03-25-2017, 08:43 PM
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Originally Posted by lhsgolf19 View Post
Jeff DiVeronica‏ @RocDevo 5h5 hours ago

Texted w/@_ClutchCarter. Says he'll know more Sunday abt his commitment to @DaytonMBB. News today: Coach Archie Miler leaving 4 @IndianaMBB

Could that mean we might know who the replacement will be tomorrow?
I responded to one of Carter's tweets, said he should wait until our new coach is announced and to keep believing, UD is a great place to be. He liked my tweet, not that it means anything, but there's always hope.
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  #106  
Old 03-25-2017, 08:50 PM
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Originally Posted by TXFlyerFan View Post
I responded to one of Carter's tweets, said he should wait until our new coach is announced and to keep believing, UD is a great place to be. He liked my tweet, not that it means anything, but there's always hope.
Don't tweet high school kids!!!!!!

I know you think you are trying to be a good fan, but it's not a good look. VCU fans have been doing it since their coaching change and a recruits mom today just asked for space and to be left alone. Players go to a school to play for a coach. If the coach changes they should absolutely consider their options.

Leave them alone and let the situation play out!
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  #107  
Old 03-25-2017, 09:37 PM
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I just think we need to hire a proven head coach, a winner someone like Ray Harper
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  #108  
Old 03-25-2017, 09:39 PM
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Originally Posted by DaytonDandy View Post
I just think we need to hire a proven head coach, a winner someone like Ray Harper
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thanks Ray
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  #109  
Old 03-25-2017, 09:54 PM
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Expectations: IU vs UD

AM obviously wants a challenge and financially he's set for life. But he'll never have a job as good as the one he just left.

I recall well when AM was hired Tim Wabler using the term, "more often than not"....re UD's expectations for the NCAA. Tim said he expects to see Dayton in the NCAAs "more often than not"....meaning making the Dance a bit more than half the time.

Contrast that to a description of IU's expectations as explained by their AD in an article in the Wall St. Journal about a week ago. He said that he expects IU to make a "deep run" in the NCAAs every year and to win national championships.

Assuming he really means that, an IU coach (e.g. Miller) would be on the hot seat after failing to make a "deep run" for three years and going one and out the last two. I'd say he'd be given one more year, two at most, and then gone if he failed to make a Sweet 16.

AM has his work cut out for him. IU ain't UD.
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  #110  
Old 03-25-2017, 09:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Sea Bass View Post
thanks Ray
Ray Harper doesn't actually use the internet. DaytonDandy is simply delusional or a close relative.
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  #111  
Old 03-25-2017, 09:58 PM
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Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
AM obviously wants a challenge and financially he's set for life. But he'll never have a job as good as the one he just left.

I recall well when AM was hired Tim Wabler using the term, "more often than not"....re UD's expectations for the NCAA. Tim said he expects to see Dayton in the NCAAs "more often than not"....meaning making the Dance a bit more than half the time.

Contrast that to a description of IU's expectations as explained by their AD in an article in the Wall St. Journal about a week ago. He said that he expects IU to make a "deep run" in the NCAAs every year and to win national championships.

Assuming he really means that, an IU coach (e.g. Miller) would be on the hot seat after failing to make a "deep run" for three years and going one and out the last two. I'd say he'd be given one more year, two at most, and then gone if he failed to make a Sweet 16.

AM has his work cut out for him. IU ain't UD.
My only question with Archie taking a big job is if he can deal with the increased media/alumni/donor obligations. We are about to find out.
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  #112  
Old 03-25-2017, 10:22 PM
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By some accounts, IU had their hearts set on Steve Alford. The AD's announcement of his wish list clearly indicated their preference for someone with Indiana ties. Maybe they reached out to Alford and were rebuffed, or maybe they thought about it and realized a much better option sat 140 miles east. Whatever the case, they got someone I think most everyone here, and many pundits across the country believe will be highly successful at IU, regardless of whatever misgivings the IU fans may have that he doesn't have ties to IU. He's a good coach, but he's also going somewhere that lends itself to being successful.

I will admit to being very disappointed right now and quite concerned about the future. However, I believe we are all ignoring the fact that, just like IU with Archie, UD is a place that lends itself to being successful. This is a job that is known to be on the same level or superior to many power conference jobs. Because of that, this job will be highly sought after by many top flight coaches looking to move up from current head coaching gigs or the assistant ranks. We will get a very good coach because we can and should be picky.

We all have our hearts set on someone who is this or that or will want to stay forever. Just like IU, we may get someone who we may not initially think is who we want, but just like IU, I'm willing to bet we get someone who is going to be outstanding in the long run.

That said, I'm willing to bet a lot of money that it's not Ray Harper...
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  #113  
Old 03-25-2017, 10:24 PM
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Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
AM obviously wants a challenge and financially he's set for life. But he'll never have a job as good as the one he just left.

I recall well when AM was hired Tim Wabler using the term, "more often than not"....re UD's expectations for the NCAA. Tim said he expects to see Dayton in the NCAAs "more often than not"....meaning making the Dance a bit more than half the time.

Contrast that to a description of IU's expectations as explained by their AD in an article in the Wall St. Journal about a week ago. He said that he expects IU to make a "deep run" in the NCAAs every year and to win national championships.

Assuming he really means that, an IU coach (e.g. Miller) would be on the hot seat after failing to make a "deep run" for three years and going one and out the last two. I'd say he'd be given one more year, two at most, and then gone if he failed to make a Sweet 16.

AM has his work cut out for him. IU ain't UD.
While I'm truly appreciative of everything Archie and his staff have done here at UD, I hope he realizes just how much his "fudge factor" has shrunk with his new job. Most on this board (and, I'm guessing, of the Flyer Faithful in general) were willing to give him a bit of a "pass" on next season, given the loss of these 4 seniors and the fact that half the roster would be new. At IU, their expectations are "deep runs" in the NCAA - EVERY YEAR - and NCAA Championships (as in, more than 1). He!!, at that rate, Calipari would be on the hot seat (I mean, only 1 title in 8 years? Come on, man!).

Again, thanks Archie. Best wishes for success in your new environs, as long as it doesn't come at the expense of UD's success.
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  #114  
Old 03-25-2017, 11:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Bucketnight View Post
Amaker is intriguing but his name is pretty prominent in the Georgetown search along with Brey and Smart. I would think he is going to let that play out and may have his sights set at a higher conference.
I'm not saying you are wrong but why would Brey want to go to Georgetown from ND???
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  #115  
Old 03-25-2017, 11:06 PM
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Originally Posted by CT Flyer View Post
I'm not saying you are wrong but why would Brey want to go to Georgetown from ND???
Supposedly there's an issue with getting ND to invest in a practice facility
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  #116  
Old 03-25-2017, 11:32 PM
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Originally Posted by UACFlyer View Post
AM obviously wants a challenge and financially he's set for life. But he'll never have a job as good as the one he just left.

I recall well when AM was hired Tim Wabler using the term, "more often than not"....re UD's expectations for the NCAA. Tim said he expects to see Dayton in the NCAAs "more often than not"....meaning making the Dance a bit more than half the time.

Contrast that to a description of IU's expectations as explained by their AD in an article in the Wall St. Journal about a week ago. He said that he expects IU to make a "deep run" in the NCAAs every year and to win national championships.

Assuming he really means that, an IU coach (e.g. Miller) would be on the hot seat after failing to make a "deep run" for three years and going one and out the last two. I'd say he'd be given one more year, two at most, and then gone if he failed to make a Sweet 16.

AM has his work cut out for him. IU ain't UD.
You know, something that is being forgotten here is the Dyshawn Pierre debacle. I heard rumblings last year that AM was livid about having his player put through this. And putting myself in AM's shoes I would be too. You have to present your university to these kids and their parents as a place where their best interest would be looked after. That they will never regret the choice. And then to have a group of students deciding your players fate would really make me think toward the future.

I've gotten the feeling that DP doesn't have the fondest of feelings for this school since he left and doubt you'll ever hear him praise it the way Sibert, DMO, B-Rob and others from the recent past do. I think AM feels as screwed as DP did over this matter and probably felt he would leave as soon as that prime, prestigious basketball school made the offer.

Did it mean the difference between having AM for more years? I don't know but it sure didn't help.
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  #117  
Old 03-25-2017, 11:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Viperstick View Post
By some accounts, IU had their hearts set on Steve Alford. The AD's announcement of his wish list clearly indicated their preference for someone with Indiana ties. Maybe they reached out to Alford and were rebuffed, or maybe they thought about it and realized a much better option sat 140 miles east. Whatever the case, they got someone I think most everyone here, and many pundits across the country believe will be highly successful at IU, regardless of whatever misgivings the IU fans may have that he doesn't have ties to IU. He's a good coach, but he's also going somewhere that lends itself to being successful.

I will admit to being very disappointed right now and quite concerned about the future. However, I believe we are all ignoring the fact that, just like IU with Archie, UD is a place that lends itself to being successful. This is a job that is known to be on the same level or superior to many power conference jobs. Because of that, this job will be highly sought after by many top flight coaches looking to move up from current head coaching gigs or the assistant ranks. We will get a very good coach because we can and should be picky.

We all have our hearts set on someone who is this or that or will want to stay forever. Just like IU, we may get someone who we may not initially think is who we want, but just like IU, I'm willing to bet we get someone who is going to be outstanding in the long run.

That said, I'm willing to bet a lot of money that it's not Ray Harper...
Of course they wanted Alford first that is why they waited until he got beat and he said no now they went with archie
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  #118  
Old 03-25-2017, 11:49 PM
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Originally Posted by T-Bone 84 View Post
While I'm truly appreciative of everything Archie and his staff have done here at UD, I hope he realizes just how much his "fudge factor" has shrunk with his new job. Most on this board (and, I'm guessing, of the Flyer Faithful in general) were willing to give him a bit of a "pass" on next season, given the loss of these 4 seniors and the fact that half the roster would be new. At IU, their expectations are "deep runs" in the NCAA - EVERY YEAR - and NCAA Championships (as in, more than 1). He!!, at that rate, Calipari would be on the hot seat (I mean, only 1 title in 8 years? Come on, man!).

Again, thanks Archie. Best wishes for success in your new environs, as long as it doesn't come at the expense of UD's success.
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Crean got 4 bids and three trips to the Sweet 16 the past 6 years and it got him fired
Archie took us once out of the first weekend the past 6 years and he is practically a basketball God
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  #119  
Old 03-25-2017, 11:58 PM
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Originally Posted by NCkevi View Post
Crean got 4 bids and three trips to the Sweet 16 the past 6 years and it got him fired
Archie took us once out of the first weekend the past 6 years and he is practically a basketball God
My point, exactly, NCkevi!
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  #120  
Old 03-25-2017, 11:58 PM
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What I do I told you that we could get a head coach with a career record over 18 years of head coaching of 463-136 including four national championships and five national runner ups. That is 18 years of head coach, was in national title game 9 of those. What would you say?
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  #121  
Old 03-25-2017, 11:59 PM
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Here is another article listing possible UD hc candidates.


http://m.herosports.com/news/archie-...ent-coach-ahah
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  #122  
Old 03-26-2017, 12:04 AM
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Originally Posted by DaytonDandy View Post
What I do I told you that we could get a head coach with a career record over 18 years of head coaching of 463-136 including four national championships and five national runner ups. That is 18 years of head coach, was in national title game 9 of those. What would you say?
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I'd say please pass whatever it is your are drinking or smoking.

Course there is a difference between "we could" and "we will"
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  #123  
Old 03-26-2017, 12:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Avid Flyer View Post
I'd say please pass whatever it is your are drinking or smoking.

Course there is a difference between "we could" and "we will"
We can get that guy tomorrow if we want to. That's ray harper resume.
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  #124  
Old 03-26-2017, 12:08 AM
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Here's an interesting name, Nick McDevitt at UNC Asheville. 37 years old and has made the tourney once and has a positive trend record wise. Recruits Ohio well and has 4 Ohio guys on his roster

Guy has a real eye for talent. He had a point guard transfer to Arizona last year, a Forward to Louisville, a guard to Marquette and another to LSU. Clearly he and has staff have an eye for talent

http://www.backingthepack.com/2017/3...rch-basketball

He also had the Big South Freshman of the Year, MaCio Teague from Cincinnati this year

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Old 03-26-2017, 12:12 AM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
Here's an interesting name, Nick McDevitt at UNC Asheville. 37 years old and has made the tourney once and has a positive trend record wise. Recruits Ohio well and has 4 Ohio guys on his roster

Guy has a real eye for talent. He had a point guard transfer to Arizona last year, a Forward to Louisville, a guard to Marquette and another to LSU. Clearly he and has staff have an eye for talent

http://www.backingthepack.com/2017/3...rch-basketball

He also had the Big South Freshman of the Year, MaCio Teague from Cincinnati this year
But if his players transfer it don't matter if he has an eye for talent, it matters if he can keep his players.
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Old 03-26-2017, 12:14 AM
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Originally Posted by DaytonDandy View Post
We can get that guy tomorrow if we want to. That's ray harper resume.
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Must admit not all that familiar with Ray Harper but there is a lot to say about that much experience. And if he would even be interested. If he is I am sure he or his agent has tossed his name in the hat.
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Old 03-26-2017, 12:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Avid Flyer View Post
But if his players transfer it don't matter if he has an eye for talent, it matters if he can keep his players.
When you're in a lower major conference like the Big South transfering out is the new reality, especially if they can go to programs likes Arizona, Louisville and Marquette.

I think it's less a knock on him and more the current reality of college basketball. SI wrote an article about this and low major leagues

http://www.si.com/college-basketball...caa-tournament
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Old 03-26-2017, 12:17 AM
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Originally Posted by NCkevi View Post
Crean got 4 bids and three trips to the Sweet 16 the past 6 years and it got him fired
Archie took us once out of the first weekend the past 6 years and he is practically a basketball God
Well, this is a question without an obvious answer but which was the bigger accomplishment? I mean isn't easier to get to the dance due to being in the big 10? Isn't easier to get past the first weekend due to the recruits you're able to land at Indiana and the Big 10? Would a Big 10 team be as apt to find themselves with only 6 scholarship players and walk-on due to suspensions? Would a Big 10 team find themselves playing with small lineups due to injury, suspension, expulsion or tragedy to one or two players?

It is all relative. What would you say would be an easier task 6 years ago, accomplishing what Archie did at Dayton or what Crean did at Indiana? And yes it is relative, let's say a coach for Wright State actually won a few NCAA games in the past 6 years, would than not be quite impressive? Would that not be as impressive as what either Miller or Crean accomplished?
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Old 03-26-2017, 12:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Smitty10 View Post
You know, something that is being forgotten here is the Dyshawn Pierre debacle. I heard rumblings last year that AM was livid about having his player put through this. And putting myself in AM's shoes I would be too. You have to present your university to these kids and their parents as a place where their best interest would be looked after. That they will never regret the choice. And then to have a group of students deciding your players fate would really make me think toward the future.

I've gotten the feeling that DP doesn't have the fondest of feelings for this school since he left and doubt you'll ever hear him praise it the way Sibert, DMO, B-Rob and others from the recent past do. I think AM feels as screwed as DP did over this matter and probably felt he would leave as soon as that prime, prestigious basketball school made the offer.

Did it mean the difference between having AM for more years? I don't know but it sure didn't help.
I have thought this for a long time but have never expressed it on this board. I feel somewhat vindicated by your post, whether it actually played a role or not. Archie does not seem like the type of person to put up with that kind of nonsense. That team with Pierre all season could have been as good as this year's team with a healthy Josh and/or Steve.

I think he stayed another year because he knew how special this year could have been. This year wasn't his fault obviously, but the stain of Pierre and the allure of one of his top jobs just a few hours away was too much for him.
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Old 03-26-2017, 12:35 AM
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I question if UD could land Crean. Seems like he would be looking for another p5 job. Some sites list him as a possibility at Georgetown.

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Old 03-26-2017, 12:49 AM
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I'm on the fence about Anthony Grant...career .637 winning % is lackluster. But did not realize he and Tom Ostrom coached together under Donovan at Florida. Ostrom is key to holding this recruiting class together, so retaining him and hiring Grant as HC could be a winning combination.
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  #132  
Old 03-26-2017, 12:49 AM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
I question if UD could land Crean. Seems like he would be looking for another p5 job. Some sites list him as a possibility at Georgetown.
Crean is a joke
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Old 03-26-2017, 12:52 AM
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Originally Posted by DaytonDandy View Post
Crean is a joke
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Well, IMO, his resume is no joke. He got Marquette to the Final 4.

Not many coaches have a Final 4 on their resume.


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_...oaching_record
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Old 03-26-2017, 01:10 AM
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Originally Posted by 1903 Flyer View Post
I'm on the fence about Anthony Grant...career .637 winning % is lackluster. But did not realize he and Tom Ostrom coached together under Donovan at Florida. Ostrom is key to holding this recruiting class together, so retaining him and hiring Grant as HC could be a winning combination.
I'd be shocked if Archie didn't take him to Indiana
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Old 03-26-2017, 01:17 AM
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Someone once posted a website that listed the lead recruiter on all recruits, I would love to see that list again if anyone has a link.

Sure would be nice if both Ostrom and Kuwik would stay at UD and continue what Archie started.
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Old 03-26-2017, 01:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Smitty10 View Post
Well, this is a question without an obvious answer but which was the bigger accomplishment?
I agree - it is also about expectations. Unless they lose a lot because of transfers due to the coaching change, they only had one senior so expectations will be high for at least a win or 2 in the NCAA tournament next year. I think Archie is a talented coach but he will have to do more in his first three years at IU in the post season than he did his last three at UD.
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Old 03-26-2017, 03:00 AM
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On second thought, I think UD could land Crean. SLU landed Travis Ford, and his resume is comparable to Crean's. I would still prefer to hire from within.
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Old 03-26-2017, 03:49 AM
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Originally Posted by ud2 View Post
I question if UD could land Crean. Seems like he would be looking for another p5 job. Some sites list him as a possibility at Georgetown.
Would Crean be interested in the Dayton job to just show IU they made a big mistake as he takes UD to the next level while IU stays where they are.
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Old 03-26-2017, 08:21 AM
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Originally Posted by ClaytonFlyerFan View Post
Someone once posted a website that listed the lead recruiter on all recruits, I would love to see that list again if anyone has a link.

Sure would be nice if both Ostrom and Kuwik would stay at UD and continue what Archie started.
I had forgotten about this article during our E8 run, but Ostrom is considered one of the best recruiters around. http://www.si.com/college-basketball...south-regional
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Old 03-26-2017, 09:12 AM
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This might get you off the fence...

Originally Posted by 1903 Flyer View Post
I'm on the fence about Anthony Grant...career .637 winning % is lackluster. But did not realize he and Tom Ostrom coached together under Donovan at Florida. Ostrom is key to holding this recruiting class together, so retaining him and hiring Grant as HC could be a winning combination.
.637 winning % is not too shabby. A few notable coaches with winning percentages lower than that...

Frank Martin, Bob McKillop, Tim Jankovich, John Beilein, Gary Williams, Mark Turgeon, Jim Valvano, Kermit Davis and our own... Don Donoher.

Grant was 76-25 in 3 seasons at VCU (.7525). 2 NCAA births and one NIT birth in 3 seasons.

His biggest mistake was going to Alabama. The kiss of death is going to a Power 5 school that cares nothing about hoops. Even so, he was 117-85 in 6 seasons with one NCAA tourney birth and 3 NIT births.

Not sure if UD is interested or if Grant would be interested in the job.

IMHO, he would be a good coach and would certainly help to retain current players and recruits. Since most recruits have dreams of playing in the NBA, Grant will add some credibility to the discussion with his NBA coaching experience, as well.
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Old 03-26-2017, 09:17 AM
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Originally Posted by MD Flyer Pride View Post
.637 winning % is not too shabby. A few notable coaches with winning percentages lower than that...

Frank Martin, Bob McKillop, Tim Jankovich, John Beilein, Gary Williams, Mark Turgeon, Jim Valvano, Kermit Davis and our own... Don Donoher.

Grant was 76-25 in 3 seasons at VCU (.7525). 2 NCAA births and one NIT birth in 3 seasons.

His biggest mistake was going to Alabama. The kiss of death is going to a Power 5 school that cares nothing about hoops. Even so, he was 117-85 in 6 seasons with one NCAA tourney birth and 3 NIT births.

Not sure if UD is interested or if Grant would be interested in the job.

IMHO, he would be a good coach and would certainly help to retain current players and recruits. Since most recruits have dreams of playing in the NBA, Grant will add some credibility to the discussion with his NBA coaching experience, as well.

We can get a guy with a .774 winning percent over 18 years of a head coach in Ray Harper, 463--136 , 9 national title game appearances in 18 years, 4 national titles.
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Old 03-26-2017, 09:23 AM
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Originally Posted by CT Flyer View Post
I'm not saying you are wrong but why would Brey want to go to Georgetown from ND???
The fact they were paying JT3 3.6mm a year and probably will go north of that contributes
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Old 03-26-2017, 09:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Smitty10 View Post
You know, something that is being forgotten here is the Dyshawn Pierre debacle. I heard rumblings last year that AM was livid about having his player put through this. And putting myself in AM's shoes I would be too. You have to present your university to these kids and their parents as a place where their best interest would be looked after. That they will never regret the choice. And then to have a group of students deciding your players fate would really make me think toward the future.

I've gotten the feeling that DP doesn't have the fondest of feelings for this school since he left and doubt you'll ever hear him praise it the way Sibert, DMO, B-Rob and others from the recent past do. I think AM feels as screwed as DP did over this matter and probably felt he would leave as soon as that prime, prestigious basketball school made the offer.

Did it mean the difference between having AM for more years? I don't know but it sure didn't help.


something to this.....
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Old 03-26-2017, 09:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Smitty10 View Post
You know, something that is being forgotten here is the Dyshawn Pierre debacle. I heard rumblings last year that AM was livid about having his player put through this. And putting myself in AM's shoes I would be too. You have to present your university to these kids and their parents as a place where their best interest would be looked after. That they will never regret the choice. And then to have a group of students deciding your players fate would really make me think toward the future.

I've gotten the feeling that DP doesn't have the fondest of feelings for this school since he left and doubt you'll ever hear him praise it the way Sibert, DMO, B-Rob and others from the recent past do. I think AM feels as screwed as DP did over this matter and probably felt he would leave as soon as that prime, prestigious basketball school made the offer.

Did it mean the difference between having AM for more years? I don't know but it sure didn't help.

Archie's departure had to do with his ambition to win a national championship and recruiting.

Archie was named in the Dayton Business Journal top 40 under 40. His quotes were very clear. "Win a national championship" That was his ambition and goal.

Read Archdeacon's article today. Archie's dad talked about having a recruit commit somewhere else. He named Michigan State as example. After UD recruited them hard, the recruit would say, "yeah but it is Izzo and Michigan State" (paraphrasing the quote). The recruit would got to a higher rated, more visible program.

Last year, I was at Flyin to the Hoop, I talked to a UD assistant about Josh Jackson (now at Kansas). Josh was uncommitted and I asked if they would try to pitch him. The coach laughed at me. His laugh said, "We have no chance".
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Old 03-26-2017, 09:37 AM
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When X hired from within were they able to hold their recruits? I think Ostrom is a logical choice with KK as associate head coach. I was very excited about the incoming class TO has best chance of keeping them.
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Old 03-26-2017, 09:39 AM
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Just read Wiki on Ray Harper, and his resume' is worth probing. Certainly wouldn't hurt to interview the guy. I have no idea what baggage he might have, but there is nothing obvious.
I think most AD's passed on Steve Fisher at SDSU and he has done a marvelous job rebuilding that shabby program to be a major contender each year.
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Old 03-26-2017, 09:47 AM
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Originally Posted by SeasonTicketFan View Post
Archie's departure had to do with his ambition to win a national championship and recruiting.

Archie was named in the Dayton Business Journal top 40 under 40. His quotes were very clear. "Win a national championship" That was his ambition and goal.

Read Archdeacon's article today. Archie's dad talked about having a recruit commit somewhere else. He named Michigan State as example. After UD recruited them hard, the recruit would say, "yeah but it is Izzo and Michigan State" (paraphrasing the quote). The recruit would got to a higher rated, more visible program.

Last year, I was at Flyin to the Hoop, I talked to a UD assistant about Josh Jackson (now at Kansas). Josh was uncommitted and I asked if they would try to pitch him. The coach laughed at me. His laugh said, "We have no chance".
It's been obvious to those on this planet that even high majors (as a rule) don't get the track-ready bigs. Those go to the heavy weight programs. But Archie showed he could develop a big with #5. He is also smart enough to know in the power schools you can draw a Freshman big who can ball immediately. Reloading is easier with instant gratification.
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Old 03-26-2017, 10:05 AM
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Originally Posted by San Diego Flyer View Post
Just read Wiki on Ray Harper, and his resume' is worth probing. Certainly wouldn't hurt to interview the guy. I have no idea what baggage he might have, but there is nothing obvious.
I think most AD's passed on Steve Fisher at SDSU and he has done a marvelous job rebuilding that shabby program to be a major contender each year.
Is this the Ray Harper that resign from WKU, if it is he has bagage
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Old 03-26-2017, 10:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Atlantic 10 View Post
Is this the Ray Harper that resign from WKU, if it is he has bagage
Maybe DaytonDandy could tell us why he resigned from Western Kentucky.
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Old 03-26-2017, 10:15 AM
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Has Shaka Smart been mentioned? Tough year at Texas but probably would not go back to A-10 huh?
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Old 03-26-2017, 10:16 AM
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He was set up. Ybthe president to resign, couple his players ran a train on a girl and filmed it, film got out so she screamed rape went to president. They held it for three months cause new nothing to it but right before conference tournament suspended his guys to force him out to bring i. Someone else cause he and president not get along. Incident happened in November not come out in players till four days before conference tournament .
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Old 03-26-2017, 10:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Gilchrist's Autograph 2 View Post
Has Shaka Smart been mentioned? Tough year at Texas but probably would not go back to A-10 huh?
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I figured he would go to Georgetown if Ewing dont
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Old 03-26-2017, 10:19 AM
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Originally Posted by TMPH66 View Post
When X hired from within were they able to hold their recruits? I think Ostrom is a logical choice with KK as associate head coach. I was very excited about the incoming class TO has best chance of keeping them.
I remember that they lost at least 2 incoming freshmen recruits, who followed SM to Arizona.

I do not recall what happened during earlier coaching changes.

I think losing players during a coaching change is just a fact of life, no matter who you hire.
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Old 03-26-2017, 10:22 AM
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I guarantee you any recruits lost, harper would replace them with better. At Jacksonville state he got 5 of the 8 new players they had this season in his little bit of time he had to work.
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Old 03-26-2017, 10:24 AM
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Just throwing out a name, here, but has anybody considered Ray Harper?
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Old 03-26-2017, 10:37 AM
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Originally Posted by MD Flyer Pride View Post
.637 winning % is not too shabby. A few notable coaches with winning percentages lower than that...

Frank Martin, Bob McKillop, Tim Jankovich, John Beilein, Gary Williams, Mark Turgeon, Jim Valvano, Kermit Davis and our own... Don Donoher.

Grant was 76-25 in 3 seasons at VCU (.7525). 2 NCAA births and one NIT birth in 3 seasons.

His biggest mistake was going to Alabama. The kiss of death is going to a Power 5 school that cares nothing about hoops. Even so, he was 117-85 in 6 seasons with one NCAA tourney birth and 3 NIT births.

Not sure if UD is interested or if Grant would be interested in the job.

IMHO, he would be a good coach and would certainly help to retain current players and recruits. Since most recruits have dreams of playing in the NBA, Grant will add some credibility to the discussion with his NBA coaching experience, as well.
Mark Gottfried preceded AG at Alabama and did well. I am just not convinced that AG can get us to the next level.
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Old 03-26-2017, 10:37 AM
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Wasn't he Chairman of the Harper Valley PTA?
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Old 03-26-2017, 10:37 AM
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Originally Posted by MD Flyer Pride View Post
.637 winning % is not too shabby... Grant was 76-25 in 3 seasons at VCU (.7525). 2 NCAA births and one NIT birth in 3 seasons... His biggest mistake was going to Alabama. The kiss of death is going to a Power 5 school that cares nothing about hoops. Even so, he was 117-85 in 6 seasons with one NCAA tourney birth and 3 NIT births.
People act like Grant was awful at Alabama. One or two more wins a year and he's got 4 NCAA tourney births in six years at Alabama.

Anyway, my preference:

1) Crean. His buddy BG would tell him to take the job, and he would.

2) Grant.

3) John Brannen. Former Grant assistant, now head coach at Northern Kentucky.

Ostrom was head recruiter at UD. But lacks Xs and Os. He won't get the job. Kuwick or Griffin could get an interview. Assistants will follow Archie. Griffin may go back to Syracuse since Hopkins left.
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Old 03-26-2017, 10:40 AM
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Originally Posted by DallasFlyer View Post
People act like Grant was awful at Alabama. One or two more wins a year and he's got 4 NCAA tourney births in six years at Alabama.

Anyway, my preference:

1) Crean. His buddy BG would tell him to take the job, and he would.

2) Grant.

3) John Brannen. Former Grant assistant, now head coach at Northern Kentucky.

Ostrom was head recruiter at UD. But lacks Xs and Os. He won't get the job. Kuwick or Griffin could get an interview. Assistants will follow Archie. Griffin may go back to Syracuse since Hopkins left.
Your list is terrible, what has John Brannon did to earn the job over someone the likes of ray harper?
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Old 03-26-2017, 10:56 AM
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Originally Posted by DaytonDandy View Post
Your list is terrible, what has John Brannon did to earn the job over someone the likes of ray harper?
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Built a tourney team in its first year of NCAA eligibility. He got kids to buy into his vision before they were even eligible for postseason play. Can't think of anything more difficult really. I think he's a stud.
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Old 03-26-2017, 11:23 AM
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How about Orlando Antigua? Been Calipar's right-hand man for years. Phenomenal recruiter.
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Old 03-26-2017, 11:24 AM
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Originally Posted by 1903 Flyer View Post
I'm on the fence about Anthony Grant...career .637 winning % is lackluster. But did not realize he and Tom Ostrom coached together under Donovan at Florida. Ostrom is key to holding this recruiting class together, so retaining him and hiring Grant as HC could be a winning combination.
Archie's winning percentage isn't that much higher than that is it?
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Old 03-26-2017, 11:32 AM
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I have a hard time believing Crean is even a possibility. It just isn't visually a good move to hire the coach that just got fired at the school that your last coach just went to. I think that alone, regardless of his potential, make it a moot point.
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Old 03-26-2017, 11:36 AM
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Didn't Ray Harper write and perform the song "Ghostbusters"???
Neil, who ya gonna call?? Ray Harper!!!


Go Flyers!!!
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Old 03-26-2017, 11:42 AM
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Built a tourney team in its first year of NCAA eligibility. He got kids to buy into his vision before they were even eligible for postseason play. Can't think of anything more difficult really. I think he's a stud.
I agree DF. Brannen is only 43 years old, spent 8-9 years as an assistant to Anthony Grant at both VCU and Alabama, and took NKU to the tournament in only his 2 year. Plus he has recruited some to the best young players into the HL. I think he would be an excellent choice.
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Old 03-26-2017, 11:52 AM
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Originally Posted by 1in25 View Post
Didn't Ray Harper write and perform the song "Ghostbusters"???
Neil, who ya gonna call?? Ray Harper!!!


Go Flyers!!!
That was Ray Parker jr. He could also probably coach just as well as Ray Harper.
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Old 03-26-2017, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by flyerfan4life View Post
How about Orlando Antigua? Been Calipar's right-hand man for years. Phenomenal recruiter.
Antigua was the head coach at USF starting in 2014 and was fired this January. USF is under NCAA investigation currently for academic fraud. BG got hired to clean up the mess Antigua left behind.
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Old 03-26-2017, 12:02 PM
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After 24 hours of thought, a few hours of sleep, and a bottle of happy juice last night next to my bon fire, I have come to the conclusion this is the best option.

Hire Kuwik, and announce it by this time tomorrow

As part of the deal, make Ostrom one of the highest paid assistant coaches in all of basketball. (Assuming Kuwik likes my idea on Ostrom)

Good coaching duo moving forward, and by all accounts two great recruiters. Hopefully most of our incoming class would stay.
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Old 03-26-2017, 12:19 PM
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Originally Posted by DallasFlyer View Post
Built a tourney team in its first year of NCAA eligibility. He got kids to buy into his vision before they were even eligible for postseason play. Can't think of anything more difficult really. I think he's a stud.
Bannon has done a great job at NKU, but the Norse got some big help in the HL tournament as the 1, 2, and 3 seeds were knocked out in their first games.
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Old 03-26-2017, 12:51 PM
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After reading hundreds of posts in the last day or so, I'm torn among three potentially great coaches to replace Miller: John Wooden, Adolf Rupp, or Ray Harper. Perhaps Phog Allen is a darkhorse candidate.
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Old 03-26-2017, 12:54 PM
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Originally Posted by ClaytonFlyerFan View Post
After 24 hours of thought, a few hours of sleep, and a bottle of happy juice last night next to my bon fire, I have come to the conclusion this is the best option.

Hire Kuwik, and announce it by this time tomorrow

As part of the deal, make Ostrom one of the highest paid assistant coaches in all of basketball. (Assuming Kuwik likes my idea on Ostrom)

Good coaching duo moving forward, and by all accounts two great recruiters. Hopefully most of our incoming class would stay.
I am not sure Griffin wouldn't be ahead of Kuwik. But the fact that none of these guys was ever promoted up to associate head coach suggests to me that Archie didn't really view any of these guys as ready to take over a program.
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Old 03-26-2017, 01:05 PM
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Originally Posted by DallasFlyer View Post
I am not sure Griffin wouldn't be ahead of Kuwik. But the fact that none of these guys was ever promoted up to associate head coach suggests to me that Archie didn't really view any of these guys as ready to take over a program.
or maybe Archie and trueteam did not want to give one guy the title and **** off the other two

How often can any head coach keep the same group of assistants together as long as Archie did? I think that is a bit unusual in this day and age of the grass is always greener on the other side

As a side note, I just saw where Mark Adams has Kuwik and AG has his top two candidates for the job, for what that is worth
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Old 03-26-2017, 01:12 PM
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Originally Posted by steve View Post
That was Ray Parker jr. He could also probably coach just as well as Ray Harper.
Outside of john Woodson tell me another coach who went to the championship game 9
Of 13 years
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Old 03-26-2017, 01:13 PM
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Would Anthony Grant be in the discussion if he wasn't an alum? I like Anthony but is his record as head coach any better than Dennis Felton?

Brennan is intriguing but I wonder how much of that is because of one NCAA trip? Would he even be in the conversation if he lost in the Horizon League. I will say this is that he seems to be able to recruit Kentucky, Indiana and Ohio at NKU
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Old 03-26-2017, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by DaytonDandy View Post
Outside of john Woodson tell me another coach who went to the championship game 9
Of 13 years
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Lets see Ray you just joined UDPride in Mar of 2017 and its all you can post is about yourself. Here's a news flash, not one UDPRider is on the hiring committee. Send your resume to the committee.
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Old 03-26-2017, 01:18 PM
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Originally Posted by DaytonDandy View Post
Outside of john Woodson tell me another coach who went to the championship game 9
Of 13 years
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Championship game of what? DII? DIII? CYO leage?

Quit hamming up some DII coach that hasn't been given a high value offer his entire career.
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Old 03-26-2017, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by CT Flyer View Post
I have a hard time believing Crean is even a possibility. It just isn't visually a good move to hire the coach that just got fired at the school that your last coach just went to. I think that alone, regardless of his potential, make it a moot point.

Generally I think you're right on target here. BUT, this might be a special circumstance.

I think you have to hire the best person for the job. Crean could be a great fit for UD for all the various reasons already mentioned. Also, he is from Michigan and I believe he lives in Michigan next door to Jim Harbaugh. Dayton is not far from Michigan and it's a great college basketball town. I'm not saying that Crean would take the UD job just because of that (or at all), but you have to think he would like to stay in the general geographic area if possible, and Dayton would allow him to do that while still coaching at a quality program with a great fan base. He'd also have a longer leash and more support than he got at Indiana.
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Old 03-26-2017, 01:20 PM
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Old 03-26-2017, 01:21 PM
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For years KWC was his dream job had many offers to leave eastern Illinois, western Illinois, Stetson to name a few
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Old 03-26-2017, 01:22 PM
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Originally Posted by DaytonDandy View Post
For years KWC was his dream job had many offers to leave eastern Illinois, western Illinois, Stetson to name a few
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Wow, those are all basketball powers.
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  #181  
Old 03-26-2017, 01:24 PM
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My guess is Ostrom follows Archie to Indiana. The head coaching job that comes from being the assistant coach who is the top recruiter at UD is to go to Ball State or something similar. The head coaching job offer to the top recruiter at Indiana would be a school like UD or something similar. Look at UD's last two head coaches for examples.

Of the three assistants my guess is Griffin would be the only one considered by UD.
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Old 03-26-2017, 01:26 PM
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Don't know enough about any of the 3 assistants to comment on their ability to pick-up where Archie left off. That said, I could foresee Griffin making the jump to Syracuse, to be groomed as Boeheim's new heir apparent. That's not too much of a foregone conclusion, given his pedigree and recruiting base.
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Old 03-26-2017, 01:35 PM
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FWIW, I wanted to re-read the hiring announcements for Kuwik, Griffin, and Ostrom.

Kuwik was hired on 4/11/2011

http://daytonflyers.com/news/2011/4/...px?path=mbball



Griffin was hired on 5/3/2011

http://daytonflyers.com/news/2011/5/...px?path=mbball


Ostrom was hired on 6/6/2011

http://daytonflyers.com/news/2011/6/...px?path=mbball
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Old 03-26-2017, 01:38 PM
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Originally Posted by DaytonDandy View Post
Outside of john Woodson tell me another coach who went to the championship game 9
Of 13 years
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Who is John Woodson?
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Old 03-26-2017, 01:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Lifelong Flyer Fan View Post
Who is John Woodson?
Mike's brother?
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  #186  
Old 03-26-2017, 01:58 PM
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Originally Posted by SeasonTicketFan View Post
Archie's departure had to do with his ambition to win a national championship and recruiting.

Archie was named in the Dayton Business Journal top 40 under 40. His quotes were very clear. "Win a national championship" That was his ambition and goal.

Read Archdeacon's article today. Archie's dad talked about having a recruit commit somewhere else. He named Michigan State as example. After UD recruited them hard, the recruit would say, "yeah but it is Izzo and Michigan State" (paraphrasing the quote). The recruit would got to a higher rated, more visible program.

Last year, I was at Flyin to the Hoop, I talked to a UD assistant about Josh Jackson (now at Kansas). Josh was uncommitted and I asked if they would try to pitch him. The coach laughed at me. His laugh said, "We have no chance".
I'm sure all of that is true, but I still think the Pierre fiasco might have played a part in the timing. I don't think Archdeacon mentioned Morgan's name once and I'm guessing she had some part in the decision also. Point being, the major, obvious strong points of moving on were mentioned, but not every detail that was weighed. AM is a professional and is not going to throw the school under the bus when listing his reasons to the press(neither will his father), it wouldn't be good professionally for him to do so.

But I did hear that he was livid last year and it's not one of those things that I can see easily being brushed aside.

The part about losing recruits to bigger schools isn't something AM learned about while we all knew the reality. It was just an example put into simple terms as to something we all already knew, including AM I'm sure, before he even took the UD job. I'm sure Sean related the difference in recruiting for Xavier and recruiting for Arizona to him long ago.
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Old 03-26-2017, 01:58 PM
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If Archie really did return Dayton to prominence, and we have money, a great arena, huge fan base, etc., then we should have no issues getting a new coach, and a good one to boot. We should not be looking for an assistant (even our own), if we have access to a current head coach with a great track record who is looking to move up to the next level. The NKU coach might be a guy like that. Heck, maybe we could have had Keats had Archie left after the first round loss.
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Old 03-26-2017, 02:07 PM
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Originally Posted by ClaytonFlyerFan View Post
As a side note, I just saw where Mark Adams has Kuwik and AG has his top two candidates for the job, for what that is worth

https://www.facebook.com/enthusiadams:


EnthusiAdams Dayton Flyer Head Coaching Candidates:

EnthusiAdams Top Two Candidates:
Kevin Kuwik
o Current assistant at UD
o Assistant to Tim O’Shea at Ohio
o Assistant to Brad Stevens at Butler
o Assistant to Thad Matta at Ohio State
o Assistant to Archie Miller at UD
Anthony Grant
o Assistant coach OKC Thunder
o former head coach Alabama and VCU
o Assistant to Billy Donovan, Florida
o former Flyer great

EnthusiAdams Big Name Options:
John Groce
o Former head coach Illinois
o Former head coach Ohio, Sweet 16
o Former assistant to Thad Matta, Ohio State and Xavier
Tom Crean
o Former head coach, Indiana
o Former head coach, Marquette
Fran Fraschilla, ESPN
o Former head coach, New Mexico, St John’s, Manhattan
o Former assistant at Ohio
Tommy Amaker, Harvard
o Former Michigan head coach
o Former Duke player, assistant

EnthusiAdams Six Regional Head Coach Options
• Keith Dambrot, Akron
• Rob Senderoff, Kent State
• Greg Kampe, Oakland
• Dane Fife, Fort Wayne
• John Brannen, NKU
• Ron Hunter, Georgia State

EnthusiAdams Up and Coming Assistant Coach Options:
• Hubert Davis, UNC
• Mike Mennega, Oregon
• Tommy Lloyd, Gonzaga
• Greg Heier, Wichita State (sister is Shauna Green)
• Luke Murray, Xavier

Last edited by ud2; 03-26-2017 at 02:11 PM..
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  #189  
Old 03-26-2017, 02:19 PM
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Originally Posted by OSU Flyer View Post
Would Anthony Grant be in the discussion if he wasn't an alum? I like Anthony but is his record as head coach any better than Dennis Felton?

Brennan is intriguing but I wonder how much of that is because of one NCAA trip? Would he even be in the conversation if he lost in the Horizon League. I will say this is that he seems to be able to recruit Kentucky, Indiana and Ohio at NKU
Anthony Grant is 100 percent in the discussion only due to being a UD alum.

I was on the fence about this but now I'm totally against it. There was an article on SI website about how the Steve Alford to Indiana pumping was all about looking to the past, a group of old people that want their nostalgia satisfied. A link to Bobby Knight. And how in the end they made the right decision in looking to the future with Miller.

Not only do I see Grant being a little of the same thing, a connection to the Donoher era, but I also see it creating a volatile situation if he isn't successful. AM built this program to new heights and I'm afraid that if Grant takes us backward to say more BG type of basketball, he will get a pass like no other. The admin would be pressured to keep giving him chances and it could set us back many years.

None of this might happen, but I don't want to take the chance.
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Old 03-26-2017, 02:34 PM
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Wink

Originally Posted by Smitty10 View Post
Anthony Grant is 100 percent in the discussion only due to being a UD alum.

I was on the fence about this but now I'm totally against it. There was an article on SI website about how the Steve Alford to Indiana pumping was all about looking to the past, a group of old people that want their nostalgia satisfied. A link to Bobby Knight. And how in the end they made the right decision in looking to the future with Miller.

Not only do I see Grant being a little of the same thing, a connection to the Donoher era, but I also see it creating a volatile situation if he isn't successful. AM built this program to new heights and I'm afraid that if Grant takes us backward to say more BG type of basketball, he will get a pass like no other. The admin would be pressured to keep giving him chances and it could set us back many years.

None of this might happen, but I don't want to take the chance.
Smitty: I am a Grant supporter and would like to see him here. But I must say you make some excellent points. If he were unsuccessful for whatever reason, he would be difficult to fire...excellent point. Now, I still like Anthony Grant, but I must say that fellow Priders are providing some very good thoughts and options.
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Old 03-26-2017, 02:42 PM
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AG was successful at VCU, but not so much at Bama. Anyone has a rational explanation as to why? If his failure to thrive at Alabama can be explained in terms of forces beyond the coach's control, I would say AG deserves a look.

Otherwise, I would lean in favor of hiring from within. For continuity's sake, hiring a coach that understands the program wholistically, and especially the system we play is least disruptive of any other options we might consider. We have good assistants, who have done well recruiting and have been with the program for several years. They should get serious consideration. I would not be at all surprised if Sullivan asked and Archie answered this very question during their meeting yesterday.
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Old 03-26-2017, 02:45 PM
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I'm with those who say hire within. It's worked well for Butler, the musties and even Gonzaga a few years back.
There is no reason to think one of the three assistants can't do the job and I strongly believe that is the only way we keep most if not all of the recruits. Just MHO
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  #193  
Old 03-26-2017, 02:48 PM
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Is Anthony Grant that good of a coach? I remember his teams being big and physical but not really that skilled offensively.

I like the sound of Amaker, NKU coach or maybe one of the assistants if someone closer to them thinks they are qualified. I think Amaker could come in and hold the team together. He obviously is going to leave for duke if it becomes available but that is understandable.

nku's coach has also proven himself at Div I level and he is close to the same area.
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  #194  
Old 03-26-2017, 03:06 PM
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Anyone know how much Indiana is paying UD to buy-out Archie's contract? I assume there is a check in the mail??????
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Old 03-26-2017, 03:10 PM
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Originally Posted by BeckysTXA View Post
Anyone know how much Indiana is paying UD to buy-out Archie's contract? I assume there is a check in the mail??????
Good question. There better be - and it better be a big one! (Nobody seems to know.)
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Old 03-26-2017, 03:13 PM
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a home and home series with IU.
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Old 03-26-2017, 03:15 PM
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there paid Crean $4M to leave. Archies contract is not public.

BTW, I like Ant Grant for a number of reasons. I hope he is the choice.
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Old 03-26-2017, 03:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Alberto Strasse View Post
a home and home series with IU.
Somebody earlier said that wasn't in Archie's contract like it was for BG.
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Old 03-26-2017, 03:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Alberto Strasse View Post
a home and home series with IU.
AD on record that that isn't in the deal
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Old 03-26-2017, 04:16 PM
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Here's an interesting article on the path Arch took for landing the gig. There's an interesting information about NC ST, How tight lipped Arch was about the courting, his appreciation for UD, and his relationship with Coach Cal. Perhaps the Alford story line was a smoke screen. Regardless this was type of opportunity Arch could not and should not pass on.

Arch 39
Fran M

http://www.mydaytondailynews.com/spo...NtcjAK7imjpUM/
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